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Eric Schmidt has applied to become a citizen of Cyprus

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Re: Eric Schmidt has applied to become a citizen of Cyprus

#361

Post by jb1991 »

beagle3 wrote: post #321
jb1991 wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In fact, the laws are so strict, they make living abroad as an honest middle-class expat a total nightmare. I have friends who cannot find a single bank in their country that will work with them because of the reporting requirements of working with US citizens. What? This is not true at all. Getting a bank in most other countries is not hard at all and certainly not a "nightmare." As a U.S. citizen you must still f…

Then you didn’t look. There’s some rule from the ‘1940s which says only a SEC-licensed broker can manage securities for a US tax payer. It was mostly ignored outside the US until 2010 but since then, together with FATCA, is very much enforced. Most of my US expat friends are lucky in that their local banks will let them have a checking account and sometimes even a savings account, but no other services are available…

>Most of my US expat friends are lucky in that their local banks will let them have a checking account

No, it's not luck. Getting a bank account is not the chore you are making it out to be. A securities broker for trading stocks -- that I have never tried -- but when it comes to opening a regular bank account, there are no major hurdles whatsoever. Your expat friends, assuming they are living legally in another country, got bank accounts because it is easy to do, not because they were lucky.

The one exception to this would be those living in another country without any formal residence permit, then in that case, it would be problematic in any country since you are technically not allowed to actually live there and many countries do not allow that for citizens of other countries (not just the U.S.).

I've lived all over the world and I have never known a single person in the American expat community who was denied opening a regular bank account anywhere -- again, assuming they were legally living in the foreign country.

Re: Eric Schmidt has applied to become a citizen of Cyprus

#362

Post by jb1991 »

norrius wrote: post #338
jb1991 wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In fact, the laws are so strict, they make living abroad as an honest middle-class expat a total nightmare. I have friends who cannot find a single bank in their country that will work with them because of the reporting requirements of working with US citizens. What? This is not true at all. Getting a bank in most other countries is not hard at all and certainly not a "nightmare." As a U.S. citizen you must still f…

> Getting a bank in most other countries is not hard at all and certainly not a "nightmare." I don't know about "most" countries, but my American colleagues in Germany and Switzerland complained about the difficulty of doing anything related to finance (banks, brokers, taxes) because of their extra tax liability. I personally had to sign quite a few forms certifying that I am not a US citizen or a greencard holder or…

The original thread was about finding a "single bank" and in that regard, it is not a problem to open a bank nearly anywhere, including in Europe (assuming legal residence there). Brokers, that might be a different matter, if you wish to trade European stocks from a European account. Taxes can be the added hassle of having to file in the U.S. regardless of where you live, but we were originally discussing getting a bank account, which is straightforward.

Re: Eric Schmidt has applied to become a citizen of Cyprus

#363

Post by ratsoman2 »

pembrook wrote: post #284
dundarious wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure Erich Schmidt has access to resources not available to your friends. There is absolutely the potential for a tax angle to this application, perhaps involving creating business entities in Cyprus to avoid the IRS's reach. That is of course just my suspicion and I could be wrong, but I think my suspicions are reasonable enough to dispute the strength of your claims ("There is no tax dodge. There is no way to d…

It's amazing to me how strongly people want to believe there's some magical way that rich Americans are avoiding taxes by hiding money in exotic locales. This was possible in the past for Americans, but it doesn't make sense anymore. That's the truth. The secretive Swiss banks and numbered accounts you read about in adventure novels as a kid are all reporting on US citizens now. It doesn't matter how much resources E…

Panama papers mean nothing to you?

Re: Eric Schmidt has applied to become a citizen of Cyprus

#364

Post by unityByFreedom »

jb1991 wrote: post #362
norrius wrote: post #338

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Getting a bank in most other countries is not hard at all and certainly not a "nightmare." I don't know about "most" countries, but my American colleagues in Germany and Switzerland complained about the difficulty of doing anything related to finance (banks, brokers, taxes) because of their extra tax liability. I personally had to sign quite a few forms certifying that I am not a US citizen or a greencard holder or…

The original thread was about finding a "single bank" and in that regard, it is not a problem to open a bank nearly anywhere, including in Europe (assuming legal residence there). Brokers, that might be a different matter, if you wish to trade European stocks from a European account. Taxes can be the added hassle of having to file in the U.S. regardless of where you live, but we were originally discussing getting a b…

You're right, they can't find a bank because they don't have a visa that allows them to work. It is common for people to say they "live" somewhere while doing visa runs, leaving and re-entering the country, in order to remain.

It's unfortunate that this statement [1] is so prominently placed in this thread. That's social media for you I guess.

[1] "I have friends who cannot find a single bank in their country that will work with them because of the reporting requirements of working with US citizens"

Re: Eric Schmidt has applied to become a citizen of Cyprus

#365

Post by bsanr2 »

Nasrudith wrote: post #214
MrZongle2 wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's entirely possible. But one could argue that would be even more reason for him to step in and try and make it better.

It could easily be throwing good money after bad - and he has moved on from it. It would be like giving money to an impoverished country with a blatantly corrupt government - it wouldn't do any good if they just waste it on say landscaping instead of say doing anything about bullying. On that note do you feel an obligation to donate even say $5 to your old high school decades later when you have no other connections…

You should do your research. ERHS is highly-ranked, especially so for a public school that is not a full magnet (it has a magnet STEM program that makes up a portion of the student body but otherwise draws from the surrounding neighborhoods). It's quite strong academically, and several of its alumni have returned to give back to it. And, generally-speaking, it's customary for highly-successful Americans (and especially those that become public figures) to give back to their high school and college alma mater.

It's a little disheartening that the immediate assumption is that "he might not have fond memories" or that "it could be throwing good money after bad." I assume that this is because the school was described as "majority-minority." ERHS students have their pick of desirable internships with the likes of NASA and the USDA, and regularly sends alumnae to Ivies and the Intel ISEF. It's not exactly an intellectually-stifling environment. We can't know what's going through Brin's mind, especially as he's never publicly discussed the subject, but we can certainly look at how his behavior compares to others, and I think HN's disregard for that in favor of a kneejerk negative reaction is shameful (if not unexpected).

Re: Eric Schmidt has applied to become a citizen of Cyprus

#366

Post by bsanr2 »

robk wrote: post #272
bsanr2 wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I went to the same high school as Sergey Brin, a little over a decade after he had and well after Google had become the de facto search standard. Didn't know until I was already in college. AFAIK he's never made an effort to reach out to them, grant resources, give a talk, anything. It's a majority-minority public school in a solidly middle class (like, actually middle class) suburb, so it's not like they're flush wi…

He hasn't done crap for college park either. Even the oculus founder has donated tons vs him

It's troubling. I could understand if he was just a modestly-wealthy ecec in some large corporation, or a founder of a small software company, but he's not. He's one of the richest men in the world, and for two decades was in direct control of one of the most powerful entities on the planet. If at the apex of such success you can't even throw a few laptops at the public services where you spent your formative years (if not for support, then for reform), then it really calls into question the societal utility of such enormous private influence and holdings. It's funny how these small anecdotes about Google's founder and their ramifications dovetail with the overarching circumstance, which is that Google has abused its position and should probably be broken up.

Re: Eric Schmidt has applied to become a citizen of Cyprus

#367

Post by gamblor956 »

dundarious wrote: post #359
pembrook wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's amazing to me how strongly people want to believe there's some magical way that rich Americans are avoiding taxes by hiding money in exotic locales. This was possible in the past for Americans, but it doesn't make sense anymore. That's the truth. The secretive Swiss banks and numbered accounts you read about in adventure novels as a kid are all reporting on US citizens now. It doesn't matter how much resources E…

I'm not claiming he is _definitively_ doing so, even just in part for tax purposes. Nor am I claiming he is not already able to use many advantageous tax loopholes in the US. I only claim two things. One, that by most reasonable definitions, Cyprus is a tax haven -- there is even a recent sordid history there, exposed in The Cyprus Papers. And two, given tax havens are often used as a means to minimize tax in transfe…

Cyprus is not a tax haven. The Cyprus Papers were about people paying for Cyprus citizenship to get the benefits of being a citizen of the EU.

Re: Eric Schmidt has applied to become a citizen of Cyprus

#368

Post by gamblor956 »

ratsoman2 wrote: post #363
pembrook wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's amazing to me how strongly people want to believe there's some magical way that rich Americans are avoiding taxes by hiding money in exotic locales. This was possible in the past for Americans, but it doesn't make sense anymore. That's the truth. The secretive Swiss banks and numbered accounts you read about in adventure novels as a kid are all reporting on US citizens now. It doesn't matter how much resources E…

Panama papers mean nothing to you?

For an American? They mean nothing. The list of Americans in the Panama Papers is extremely small, and all of them shifted their money before 9/11.

It's simply not possible to do stuff like that anymore.

Re: Eric Schmidt has applied to become a citizen of Cyprus

#369

Post by gamblor956 »

jedberg wrote: post #204
garmaine wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In which case you pay an "exit tax" equivalent to the tax hit from liquidating all your assets, e.g. capgains on all held stock. Renouncing citizenship never works as a tax dodge, unless you have some reason to expect large future gains in your assets that aren't reflected in their current market prices.

Like what Facebook's cofounder did right before the IPO.

Unlike Schmidt, Saverin was not born a U.S. citizen. He only became a U.S. citizen when his parents emigrated to FL during his teenage years.

Also, unlike Schmidt, Saverin has spent most of his adult life actually living outside of the U.S. and had been living outside of the U.S. for years before finally renouncing his citizenship.

Re: Eric Schmidt has applied to become a citizen of Cyprus

#370

Post by piva00 »

Splendor wrote: post #274
gumby wrote: post #270

Why are people assuming this is a tax issue? It's just most people find it nicer to live in the EU, even billionaires, and especially if you don't need to worry about work.

If that were the case, then why wouldn't he try to obtain citizenship in the country he's moving to? Why Cyprus?

Cyprus, Malta and Bulgaria have "citizenship for sale". The EU is fighting this back, rich investors buying their way into Schengen with no ties (or even residency requirements) to the countries they get passports from is very frowned upon.

Apart from that quite a lot of other EU members offer residency for investors, not ideal either but better than outright sales of passports.

If you aren't rich the rules for citizenship vary quite a bit between member states but they all require some years of residency and tax payments to qualify for citizenship.

Here in Sweden I'm going through the process and it's one of the most straightforward citizenship processes: live here for 5 years legally on a visa, pay your taxes and you qualify.

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