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Have Fruits and Vegetables Become Less Nutritious? (2011)

scientificamerican.com

21–30 of 239 posts

Re: Have Fruits and Vegetables Become Less Nutritious? (2011)

#21
post #5

Blueberries that taste the same but are transparent in the middle. Tomatoes that tase water. Cucumber that look great and almost tasteless. You don't know what you are missing if you have never tasted the "real" deal.

Almost tasteless cucumber is great!

Especially for kids. In summer, my kids ask for a cold cucumber instead of a can of soda. I guess if the cucumber was too tasty they wouldn't really like it as much. It's "chewy water", just like watermelon but without the sweet.

Re: Have Fruits and Vegetables Become Less Nutritious? (2011)

#22
post #3

See also [0] which seems to argue convincingly against this. [0] Mineral nutrient composition of vegetables, fruits and grains: The context of reports of apparent historical declines https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S088915751...

There seems to be some common ground (even if soil is in dispute!) on high yield dilution though. The abstract states:

Contemporaneous analyses of modern versus old crop varieties grown side-by-side, and archived samples, show lower mineral concentrations in varieties bred for higher yields where increased carbohydrate is not accompanied by proportional increases in minerals – a “dilution effect”.

Re: Have Fruits and Vegetables Become Less Nutritious? (2011)

#23
post #12
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but this is not about taste in the first place, it's about the nutritional value of your produce. After all, eating fulfills more than one purpose.

Yeah, but when formerly tasty you would eat for pleasure of it tomatos turn into paper, you wont eat them at all.

That's kinda true. Alternative, if you personal life style allows for it, you may start growing your own tomatoes -- you might not get them all year around that way, but the taste difference is so worth it.

And in the end, you gotta eat something. I suppose instead of not eating anything healthy at all, the more prominent strategy seems to have been to accompany healthy produce with super-unhealthy condiments (basically, loads of sugar, salt, and fat) to make it tasty again. That's probably the more worrying consequence, though.

Re: Have Fruits and Vegetables Become Less Nutritious? (2011)

#25
post #3

See also [0] which seems to argue convincingly against this. [0] Mineral nutrient composition of vegetables, fruits and grains: The context of reports of apparent historical declines https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S088915751...

> Comparisons with matching archived soil samples show soil mineral content has not declined in locations cultivated intensively with various fertilizer treatments.

So not that depleted soils don’t deplete vegetables, but the soils they found were not depleted. I wonder if they were focused on the same soils

Re: Have Fruits and Vegetables Become Less Nutritious? (2011)

#26
post #19
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't be surprised if there's a relation between taste and nutritional value though.

Well, taste is subjective - nutritional value less so.

True, but that's orthogonal. You could still set up double-blind studies comparing taste, I think.

Re: Have Fruits and Vegetables Become Less Nutritious? (2011)

#27

Well, who here buys their vegetables based on nutrition? Who even knows how nutritious their particular vegetables are (probably not if you have a lab)? Companies optimize for what customers will pay for, and everything else falls by the wayside.

In a way, I would say I do - but not to a point where I buy completely untasty stuff just for the nutritional value. But I love it when I see, say, a beautiful cauliflower that looks fresh and tasty not only because I'm looking forward to the pleasure of tasting it but also because somewhere in the back of my head something tells me "that's good stuff".

However, of course I'm just assuming that something is actually nutritious. You're right that I don't actually know that, and that kinda is the point of the article, right? We have all been taught that veggies are good for you, bla bla bla, but in the light of the article you can now at least wonder to what degree that is still as true as it was some years ago.

Re: Have Fruits and Vegetables Become Less Nutritious? (2011)

#28
post #5

Blueberries that taste the same but are transparent in the middle. Tomatoes that tase water. Cucumber that look great and almost tasteless. You don't know what you are missing if you have never tasted the "real" deal.

I am certain that a vast majority of people have never tasted a "real" tomato. Here in the UK (though I'm sure this applies globally), tomatoes sold in supermarkets taste like plastic. Reason being is that they are picked when they are green and they "ripen" by the time they get to the store shelf. This is done because tomatoes are almost impossible to transfer safely in large quantities, because when they are ripe t…

I think there's also a genetic component. I planted Roma seeds from a store bought tomato, grew the plant, and they still didn't have much flavour compared to any other garden tomato I've tried.

Re: Have Fruits and Vegetables Become Less Nutritious? (2011)

#29
post #5

Blueberries that taste the same but are transparent in the middle. Tomatoes that tase water. Cucumber that look great and almost tasteless. You don't know what you are missing if you have never tasted the "real" deal.

I am certain that a vast majority of people have never tasted a "real" tomato. Here in the UK (though I'm sure this applies globally), tomatoes sold in supermarkets taste like plastic. Reason being is that they are picked when they are green and they "ripen" by the time they get to the store shelf. This is done because tomatoes are almost impossible to transfer safely in large quantities, because when they are ripe t…

Can confirm. Does this also apply to canned Tomatos or are those allowed to ripe on soil, because damage didn’t matter? I think they taste better and I’ve Heard- than many top chefs prefer them over “fresh” tomatoes for cooking.

Re: Have Fruits and Vegetables Become Less Nutritious? (2011)

#30
post #24

Do pesticides and herbicides reduce soil quality? The article says avoiding them is beneficial but it's not clear why that is.

Well it kills some living organism. These don't develop. It has a result on environnement including soil. Now it's it measurable everywhere? No.

There are a couple research papers and video documentaries that compare on the same area, sometime same hill, the difference in soil: one was marking as the only difference was treatment or zero treatment. Difference was around 5 inches / 15 cm higher soil in non treated parcel...

Now this is exactly the kind of question where everyone is going to find examples that suit their personal view, even with studies backing their point. It so much depends on region and soil, treatment, measurability of molecule effects etc...

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