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Biden wins White House, vowing new direction for divided U.S.

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Re: Biden wins White House, vowing new direction for divided U.S.

#651

Post by jakear »

sanguy wrote: post #647

Canadian who has been living in the US for 5 years. Perm resident but not naturalized. Arrived a year and a bit before Trump 2016 win. This election was so polarizing I am very afraid the country can recover from it. I am worried enough we have bug out bags packed, with critical documents, as I expect this could easily escalate to a civil war as both sides are convinced they are right; and more worrisome is that the…

Guessing you’re referring to:

> Is anyone archiving these Trump sycophants for when they try to downplay or deny their complicity in the future? I foresee decent probability of many deleted Tweets, writings, photos in the future

> Lol at the “party of personal responsibility” being upset at the idea of being responsible for their behavior over last four years

Which I’m sure all will agree is not how you have characterized it.

If I’m incorrect pls provide sources.

Re: Biden wins White House, vowing new direction for divided U.S.

#652

Post by chrchang523 »

opportune wrote: post #600

My biggest concern is how seemingly so many conservative people are becoming huge conspiracy theorists. I don't mean normal conspiracy theories like there being something more behind the JFK assassination, but like QAnon, Bill Gates injecting people with microchips, Pizzagate, etc. A lot of people in my own family in a rather backwards state believe that stuff. It's making me completely lose faith in this country and…

"One man's modus ponens is another man's modus tollens."

Someone who was e.g. raised as a Christian, and then concluded that some of the stories they were told in Sunday School were lies, is likely to treat an appeal to religious authority as evidence against a claim. Even in domains where Christian groups have been effective in practice.

The same can be said about mainstream media or science.

In the short term, it's practically impossible to reach such people without identifying somewhere they're actually right in their rejection of the mainstream narrative, and gaining their trust by recognizing that. Only with that trust do you have a shot of being listened to when you point out where they overcorrected against the mainstream narrative.

In the longer term, it would really help if some key mainstream narratives became more accurate. Without that, "getting out of the country" may actually become the best option for an increasing number of people.

Re: Biden wins White House, vowing new direction for divided U.S.

#653

Post by Solvitieg »

opportune wrote: post #600

My biggest concern is how seemingly so many conservative people are becoming huge conspiracy theorists. I don't mean normal conspiracy theories like there being something more behind the JFK assassination, but like QAnon, Bill Gates injecting people with microchips, Pizzagate, etc. A lot of people in my own family in a rather backwards state believe that stuff. It's making me completely lose faith in this country and…

I think the size of these groups are greatly exaggerated by social media.

Conspiracy theorists have always existed and are practically harmless.

Sure there are incidents that occur, but likewise, 1000 people a month die from falling down the stairs. It's just not a problem in the grand scheme of things.

Re: Biden wins White House, vowing new direction for divided U.S.

#654

Post by rzz3 »

gigatexal wrote: post #138

What is really keeping me up at night is the existential problem the US faces for the next 50 years: the ever increasingly large divide that is the polarizing of the electorate. We have to come together as Americans or someone will divide and conquer us.

Rather than blame the left or blame the right for this, I think what we really need is a third party and Instant Runoff Voting.

Re: Biden wins White House, vowing new direction for divided U.S.

#655

Post by heresie-dabord »

gigatexal wrote: post #138

What is really keeping me up at night is the existential problem the US faces for the next 50 years: the ever increasingly large divide that is the polarizing of the electorate. We have to come together as Americans or someone will divide and conquer us.

US social discourse shows that people don't understand how to debate and how to negotiate with opposing views for a better outcome. These are merely group behaviours and they can change with time and education.

I feel that the first structural steps must be

1./ Replace First Past the Post (it distorts the will of the people) with some version of ranked balloting (already in use in at least one US state)

2./ Dissolve or fix/improve the Electoral College

Re: Biden wins White House, vowing new direction for divided U.S.

#656

Post by Karrot_Kream »

zebrafish wrote: post #368
gigatexal wrote: post #138

What is really keeping me up at night is the existential problem the US faces for the next 50 years: the ever increasingly large divide that is the polarizing of the electorate. We have to come together as Americans or someone will divide and conquer us.

I honestly believe this is just a return to normal for both sides. Conservatism, before being injected with neoliberalism by Thatcher and Reagan, has been about leaving other countries alone while focusing on protecting American interests. Speak softly and carry a big stick. Conservatives have never wanted US hegemony traditionally. Preservation of Bretton Woods has had to be a focus post-WWII in order to combat the…

> I honestly believe this is just a return to normal for both sides. Conservatism, before being injected with neoliberalism by Thatcher and Reagan, has been about leaving other countries alone while focusing on protecting American interests. Speak softly and carry a big stick. Conservatives have never wanted US hegemony traditionally. Preservation of Bretton Woods has had to be a focus post-WWII in order to combat the spread of anti-American communism. Now that the Cold War has ended, conservatives have tried to find a way back to focusing on American interests. It’s a delicate balance that has to be struck though. I think this is also the reason for the split in the Democratic Party. “Establishment” members are focused on preserving the neoliberal Bretton Woods status quo. The progressives are focused on doing away with the oligarchy that system has created and moving towards a more socialistic global society.

I would agree, to some extent, if Trump wasn't the Conservative candidate. Trump has flouted the law to the extent that very, very few American Presidents have. Where I was afraid that Obama was passing too many Executive Orders, Trump outright tried to rule by Executive Order fiat. Conservative parties pre-Bretton Woods were certainly isolationist and domestic-first, but also had a deep affection for the rule of law. I would oppose a traditionally conservative party politically, but would not be nearly as negative about it as I am about a President that seems to want to actively subvert rule of law.

Re: Biden wins White House, vowing new direction for divided U.S.

#657

Post by joeevans1000 »

gigatexal wrote: post #138

What is really keeping me up at night is the existential problem the US faces for the next 50 years: the ever increasingly large divide that is the polarizing of the electorate. We have to come together as Americans or someone will divide and conquer us.

Interestingly, tech workers are responsible for such a resilient divide. Tech workers, the most numerous demographic on this thread, are the ones coding up the bubbles or creating and maintaining their infrastructure.

The purpose of the bubbles is to keep you clicking or pressing. The purpose of that is to deliver ads or sell premium services. If uncomfortable views are presented a user may click or press out of the service. Those uncomfortable views are not to be confused with click bait allowed to drive bubble responses.

No use blaming the architects or company leaders. If you are coding it up, maintaining the infrastructure, or providing auxiliary support to the bubble, you are responsible. The companies making the bubbles can't do it without you, and you are the one actually making it happen.

Re: Biden wins White House, vowing new direction for divided U.S.

#659

Post by ablekh »

OK, so the transition from Make America Great Again slogan to Make America Decent Again (and Better) reality is inevitable and welcome. It is easy to get overjoyed by results of the U.S. Presidential Election (and some celebration certainly is in order).

Uniting the country is definitely a commendable goal, though it is easier said than done. The election results across all levels clearly illustrate just how divided and polarized this land is. Thus, it will take quite a lot of time and effort to see a reasonable progress on this front. We all can play our part in it by a polite and constructive dialog with opponents and first finding common ground on such pressing and all-encompassing issues as coronavirus pandemic, environmental protection, social justice and health care reform.

In the meantime, let us not forget that, in order to restore the heavily damaged moral fabric of this country, relevant measures should pass through the Congress. And while Democrats retain control of the House, the opposing party might retain control of the Senate. Which most certainly will lead to a significant gridlock in moving forward with the democratic and, in some cases, progressive agenda unless Democrats retake control in the Senate. Remember, winning a battle is not a guarantee for winning a war. That is why the U.S. Senate run-off elections in Georgia to be held on January 5 (https://georgia.gov/vote-2020-runoff-elections) are crucial.

Re: Biden wins White House, vowing new direction for divided U.S.

#660

Post by dsomers »

sanguy wrote: post #647

Canadian who has been living in the US for 5 years. Perm resident but not naturalized. Arrived a year and a bit before Trump 2016 win. This election was so polarizing I am very afraid the country can recover from it. I am worried enough we have bug out bags packed, with critical documents, as I expect this could easily escalate to a civil war as both sides are convinced they are right; and more worrisome is that the…

I looked up that tweet from AOC [0] and you’re really exaggerating what she said. Shame one you.

[0]https://mobile.twitter.com/AOC/status/1324807776510595078

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