Live data from Hacker News

Why Silicon Valley has so many Bad Managers

getlighthouse.com

31–40 of 76 posts

Re: Why Silicon Valley has so many Bad Managers

#31

> With a manager only a few years older than you, you have a tough experience. So I'm pretty early in my career but have already had multiple experiences having managers who are a little younger than me. I want it to be fine, but it's just hard to see them as any kind of authority. How do other folks make this work?

I mean I don't expect much out of managers so whether they are younger or older doesn't really matter to me. I see leadership of any sort as service. Truth and service should be the motto of every leader. They seek the truth out methodically, thoughtfully and doggedly.

Truth seeking is ultimately about accepting reality and calling things like they are which is, of course, harder than it sounds. We have all sort of motivations to lie to others and, more importantly, ourselves. As a manager this is compounded because you don't have control over what you are responsible for, you're relying on other people to do the work you are held accountable for so you start lying to yourself about how your team is doing, how communications is happening or not happening and a host of other things. The good managers learn to not do this.

Re: Why Silicon Valley has so many Bad Managers

#32
I'm a developer and I admit the truth is that managers are bad only because developers are worse.

Turnover in tech is extremely high and it's not because devs are constantly being mismanaged, it's because they are egotistical and capable of working independently and often just do without any real penalty. "Oh you fired me, well 9 times out of 10 I'll just be earning more money across the street, good luck recruiting anyone with a bad Glassdoor review!" What incentives does the manager have to get invested with the devs in this situation when employees good and bad can just leave easily.

Anyone who's worked in tach a while has seen cases where a dev has just flat out refused to do something a manager has asked them to do. Why? Ego is the only reason when you get paid either way.

Look at all the egotistical devs on this forum alone saying "all managers are bad" without considering they could be part of the problem.

Re: Why Silicon Valley has so many Bad Managers

#33

Lighthouse looks like an interesting product, particularly the skip-level insights and 1:1 scheduling. There is a new type of bad manager taking over, that does all the little things from contemporary management wisdom right, but is adrift as a leader and a bit delusional about the aura of thoughtfulness they project, personal wisdom and ability to mentor. To put it too glibly, it is what happens when one understands…

Knowing what to do is a hugely uphill battle on its own, but then actually being brave and making the time to have the necessary discussions with your team is another level. Many managers are afraid of doing so or fear the time commitment.

The counter intuitive lesson many leaders have to learn is that when you proactively have these discussions that align interests between employee and company, while also showing some empathy for your team, you fix many problems when they're super easy, instead of massive fires to fight.

With all that in mind, that is exactly why I started Lighthouse; knowing what to do and then actually doing it are two separate things. Keeping it all in Google docs and making your own system from scratch rarely holds together as well as someone automating things and reminding you of the right things to do.

Re: Why Silicon Valley has so many Bad Managers

#34

I'm a developer and I admit the truth is that managers are bad only because developers are worse. Turnover in tech is extremely high and it's not because devs are constantly being mismanaged, it's because they are egotistical and capable of working independently and often just do without any real penalty. "Oh you fired me, well 9 times out of 10 I'll just be earning more money across the street, good luck recruiting…

> flat out refused to do something

that will cause a cascade of other problems because it can't be tested properly because no time has been spent automating regression because the managers agreed to unrealistic timelines because they're not the ones who have to deal with the fallout.

Re: Why Silicon Valley has so many Bad Managers

#35

> With a manager only a few years older than you, you have a tough experience. So I'm pretty early in my career but have already had multiple experiences having managers who are a little younger than me. I want it to be fine, but it's just hard to see them as any kind of authority. How do other folks make this work?

If you're doing it right as a manager, it's not about authority. Instead, you should be working to align interests and support your team.

Having someone younger than you as a manager can feel awkward, but if they actually invest in you and listen to you, it can be a great relationship...especially if you know you don't want to be a manager. Then, it's like this person is doing you a favor, so you can stick to the IC work you like.

Re: Why Silicon Valley has so many Bad Managers

#36
post #7

In my experience everywhere has bad managers. I’ll volunteer that until I got wise to my own failings and quit being one that I was one of them. It’s a hard job. What we need is for our educational system to incorporate management training from the earliest grades. I’m not talking about books on business or BS like that, but teaching the soft skills that people need to manage other people. Irrespective of the field o…

Totally agree. Trying to lead clubs and student groups in college taught me more about leading than anything I did in a classroom.

Re: Why Silicon Valley has so many Bad Managers

#37
post #19

I'm not so impressed with this article, and partly it's because of the rather bad news: There's not much to be done about bad management. Peter Drucker, well worth reading if you haven't, said that the thing that makes a manager is character . My definition of character is someone who takes action that may have serious negative personal consequences (extreme version: high-profile whistle blowing). Character can't be…

I appreciate the skepticism, but that's a very fixed mindset. People can absolutely change and I've seen it hundreds of times. It certainly can take a "come to Jesus" moment like you find out your team hates you, you get fired, a wave of employees quit on you, etc, but people can absolutely change when they decide to. Character is absolutely important, and it does predispose one to being a better manager, but you can…

I do believe in change too, but what I've seeing in many places are temporary changes to save your job or get a promotion, not a real change, a profound change.

Re: Why Silicon Valley has so many Bad Managers

#38

Managers are terrible everywhere

My friend's wife texted me recently to talk to her very unhappy husband. During my conversation, he mentioned that he has a really good relationship with his skip level manager. Based on what he told me, I advised him to work to replace his bad manager.

If you want to be successful (however you want to define success) and anyone or anything stands in your way then make it your job to overcome it.

Re: Why Silicon Valley has so many Bad Managers

#39

I'm a developer and I admit the truth is that managers are bad only because developers are worse. Turnover in tech is extremely high and it's not because devs are constantly being mismanaged, it's because they are egotistical and capable of working independently and often just do without any real penalty. "Oh you fired me, well 9 times out of 10 I'll just be earning more money across the street, good luck recruiting…

It's certainly a two way street between a manager and team member to work well together, but in my experience the best managers in Silicon Valley/tech retain great people for a long time. In fact, many bring former team members with them from company to company, being a talent magnet.

Re: Why Silicon Valley has so many Bad Managers

#40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I appreciate the skepticism, but that's a very fixed mindset. People can absolutely change and I've seen it hundreds of times. It certainly can take a "come to Jesus" moment like you find out your team hates you, you get fired, a wave of employees quit on you, etc, but people can absolutely change when they decide to. Character is absolutely important, and it does predispose one to being a better manager, but you can…

I do believe in change too, but what I've seeing in many places are temporary changes to save your job or get a promotion, not a real change, a profound change.

Yeah, certainly consequences matter. The more they have to change or else X (which they really don't want), the more likely they are to change. That said, unfortunately, many will only do just enough to not get fired.
Post reply on HN