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Python overtakes Java to become the second-most popular programming language

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Re: Python overtakes Java to become the second-most popular programming language

#11

Post by teilo »

dep_b wrote: post #7

The past month I have used Python again after a few years and I have to say I didn't quite like the experience as much as before. On one hand I also used vanilla Python instead of something easier to use like Django but the amount of preventable run-time errors and the lack of IDE autocomplete support at various points was kind of off-putting after coming back from very strictly typed languages like Swift, Kotlin or…

Your blaming Python because you used a poor IDE and failed to use type annotations?

Re: Python overtakes Java to become the second-most popular programming language

#12

Post by 0-_-0 »

taffer wrote: post #6
_lbaq wrote: post #3

Python is certainly popular, but the TIOBE Index ranking is not credible. Quote: "The ratings are based on the number of skilled engineers world-wide, courses and third party vendors. " According to this index, "Logo", beats out Rust, Scala, Kotlin, and Cobol. I cannot remind myself when I last time saw a course, book or even any source code covering Logo. This must be some very poorly vetted, automatically collected…

That C is supposed to be the most popular language makes the whole ranking questionable. The stackoverflow ranking[1] corresponds much more to my own experience in real life. [1] https://insights.stackoverflow.com/survey/2020#most-popular-...

On the other hand the stackoverflow survey might show that C is so simple that programmers using it don't need stackoverflow :)

Re: Python overtakes Java to become the second-most popular programming language

#13

Post by dtech »

I personally find the methodology used in TIOBE very dubious. It frequently has very large differences with other metrics, and often "feels wrong" compared to those other metrics.

It mainly seems to massively overvalue historical significance, the older the language the higher it is. E.g. the current ranking has Perl 5x more popular than Typescript, and Visual Basic 2x as popular than PHP.

Re: Python overtakes Java to become the second-most popular programming language

#15

Post by tomohawk »

Of the top 10, only Java has experienced a year on year drop.

So, at least some of the gains are at the expense of Java.

For C and C++, you're probably not going to reach for Python as a replacement. It's not like in the 90s when these were considered general purpose. If you're using them these days, it's more likely due to needing to use them.

Java is still used for a lot of other things where a language like Python would be fine and likely more productive. Also, I have a feeling that the large growth in go from #20 to #13 likely also came at the expense of Java.

That, and the pie is growing. Python is taking a larger share of the larger pie.

Re: Python overtakes Java to become the second-most popular programming language

#16

Post by learnstats2 »

_lbaq wrote: post #3

Python is certainly popular, but the TIOBE Index ranking is not credible. Quote: "The ratings are based on the number of skilled engineers world-wide, courses and third party vendors. " According to this index, "Logo", beats out Rust, Scala, Kotlin, and Cobol. I cannot remind myself when I last time saw a course, book or even any source code covering Logo. This must be some very poorly vetted, automatically collected…

Logo is still very commonly used in early educational settings - maybe not typically for engineering applications, but I'm confident it has far more people using it than the other languages you list.

Re: Python overtakes Java to become the second-most popular programming language

#17

Post by zusoomro »

smt88 wrote: post #2

We need to start ranking languages based on what people use them for. Python is certainly #1 in ML, for example, but far from #1 in web. I had a "which stack" argument with a client recently for a web server processing tons of data. He wanted to use Node (which I hate, but also use when performance doesn't matter because TypeScript is so good). I showed him that the Node library ecosystem is actually pretty weak (man…

Just curious, what other server side languages do you feel have a better library ecosystem than Node/JS?

Re: Python overtakes Java to become the second-most popular programming language

#18

Post by dep_b »

teilo wrote: post #11
dep_b wrote: post #7

The past month I have used Python again after a few years and I have to say I didn't quite like the experience as much as before. On one hand I also used vanilla Python instead of something easier to use like Django but the amount of preventable run-time errors and the lack of IDE autocomplete support at various points was kind of off-putting after coming back from very strictly typed languages like Swift, Kotlin or…

Your blaming Python because you used a poor IDE and failed to use type annotations?

I'm using PyCharm, if you have anything better than that don't hesitate. But the type annotations are obviously something that also needs to be added to all other code I touch, not just my own.

Re: Python overtakes Java to become the second-most popular programming language

#19

Post by azeirah »

zusoomro wrote: post #17
smt88 wrote: post #2

We need to start ranking languages based on what people use them for. Python is certainly #1 in ML, for example, but far from #1 in web. I had a "which stack" argument with a client recently for a web server processing tons of data. He wanted to use Node (which I hate, but also use when performance doesn't matter because TypeScript is so good). I showed him that the Node library ecosystem is actually pretty weak (man…

Just curious, what other server side languages do you feel have a better library ecosystem than Node/JS?

PHP has a solid library ecosystem, especially around Laravel, which is what I know best.

Re: Python overtakes Java to become the second-most popular programming language

#20

Post by tluyben2 »

zusoomro wrote: post #17
smt88 wrote: post #2

We need to start ranking languages based on what people use them for. Python is certainly #1 in ML, for example, but far from #1 in web. I had a "which stack" argument with a client recently for a web server processing tons of data. He wanted to use Node (which I hate, but also use when performance doesn't matter because TypeScript is so good). I showed him that the Node library ecosystem is actually pretty weak (man…

Just curious, what other server side languages do you feel have a better library ecosystem than Node/JS?

JVM based languages? Also I like the .NET ecosystem as it comes with batteries included and is quick to develop with.
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