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So you want to buy a farm?

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Re: So you want to buy a farm?

#81

Post by adwww »

brnt wrote: post #72
driverdan wrote: post #20

I always laugh when someone who has never worked on a farm talks about buying one. Most farming is hard work, much harder than an office job. And most small farms do not make much money, especially if you don't know what you're doing. If you're thinking about it go get a job on one first before you buy anything.

I don't know how things are in your jurisdiction, but here in Europe making a profit on farming just isn't possible. This sector lives and dies by subsidies. You're going to have a cash crop or market the hell out of your product, both seem opposite to the goal of starting the farm in the first place.

My family make more profit renting an old workers cottage on the farm as an Airbnb than they get revenue from the entire organic diary operation.

Re: So you want to buy a farm?

#82

Post by arethuza »

dirktheman wrote: post #71
driverdan wrote: post #20

I always laugh when someone who has never worked on a farm talks about buying one. Most farming is hard work, much harder than an office job. And most small farms do not make much money, especially if you don't know what you're doing. If you're thinking about it go get a job on one first before you buy anything.

I know some farmers and they all have one thing in common: they work around the clock, 7 days a week. No days off or vacations. Their farms might be worth millions, but it's also both their home and their job. Also, a lot of people don't get that a farm (anything other than subsistence farming) is a business. It requires careful long term planning, crop rotation, dealing with buyers, collectives, auctions, risk mitig…

I've known a lot of farmers over the years and they always struck me as some of the most hard nosed and astute businessmen I've ever met.

Edit: Having done a bit of both (and a lot of family in both areas) I'd rather be a fisherman than a farmer and I really don't want to be a fisherman!

Re: So you want to buy a farm?

#83

Post by sixstringtheory »

lostlogin wrote: post #45
dylan604 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems to me if you want to do this, you're missing out on the experience. Push a button, get a prize is not very rewarding in the long run. When I started my backyard growing habit, it was never meant as a self-sustaining venture. It became part of my morning routine, I'd water the plants and just keep an eye on things. Watching the plant's growth from day to day is rather impressive. It's amazing how fast different…

> Seems to me if you want to do this, you're missing out on the experience. Push a button, get a prize is not very rewarding in the long run. I disagree. I installed Home Assistant, got some smart plugs and ESP chips and bought a solenoid. Sitting on the deck and seeing the sprinkler go at sundown +30mins or getting the Slack alert as it turns on and off is very satisfying. There is plenty of hard work to do, but I r…

I love the experience but hate feeling chained to my garden when I want to take a weeks long trip into the wilderness. I primarily want to automate looking after my garden in my absence.

Re: So you want to buy a farm?

#84

Post by OJFord »

spiderfarmer wrote: post #47
mod wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would look at youtube, there's a very active homesteading community.

What’s their main revenue stream? The homesteading itself, courses or the Youtube advertising dollars? Selling the dream is always more profitable than living it.

Maybe I misunderstand the term, but why would 'homesteading' necessarily be much if anything it a revenue stream? Doesn't it mean roughly 'doing things that shift the scale towards self-sufficiency'?

Re: So you want to buy a farm?

#85

Post by happy-go-lucky »

FlyingSnake wrote: post #55
zenxblr wrote: post #30

I wrote that. Thanks @happy-go-lucky for sharing that. This is indeed an India based pov. And based on real life experiences and learnings over 4 years now at this farm. Lots more to learn and understand, surely. I'm sure there's some stuff that translates well across geography too, especially the patience bit. Do want to see regenerative farming grow, because as it happens today is eventually a dead end.

First of all kudos for sharing your wonderful experience. I must say geography also helped you a lot with your experience. Your experience would've been much different if your farm was in Bidar or Anantpur. I would love to hear more about your journey and keep sharing your tales with us!

> Your experience would've been much different if your farm was in Bidar or Anantpur.

I'm from the latter, own some ancestral land there. Here, we're always on the lookout for ways to counter the extreme aridity of the region. We know it's not easy and like asking the impossible.

Re: So you want to buy a farm?

#86

Post by avar »

holoduke wrote: post #78
brnt wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know how things are in your jurisdiction, but here in Europe making a profit on farming just isn't possible. This sector lives and dies by subsidies. You're going to have a cash crop or market the hell out of your product, both seem opposite to the goal of starting the farm in the first place.

Depends on which farm sector. Part of my family is into flowers. I can tell you that flowers are like gold. Almost every flower farmer in our region is loaded. Lowest tier for farming are traditional crops. You need lots of acres and good machines to get efficient en break-even. Only a few manage, but most do not. I would probably focus on farm tech. Automated greenhouses growing tomatoes, cucumbers etc is for exampl…

Your other comments reveal you're living in The Netherlands. The farming sector there is massively subsidized both via EU and local funds. Now during COVID-19 the state is bankrolling up to 70% of the revenue of the horticulture industry[1].

And that's before you get into all the indirect subsidies like zoning, fuel subsidies for industrial use etc. that are largely aimed at subsidizing farmers.

1. https://www.arc2020.eu/flower-power-commission-somehow-appro...

Re: So you want to buy a farm?

#87

Post by vram22 »

vram22 wrote: post #75
raptorraver wrote: post #40

I'm starting to sell my city apartment this week and we are going to move to the country side to start a small scale farm! I've worked in the farm all my youth and this summer we lived on the place and did some small scale gardening. I don't have any (at least many) false thoughts about how cool and romantic it will be. It will be hard and frustrating at times but waay more fulfilling than the current tech job. We're…

Yes, Richard Perkins knows and has done a lot of good stuff over years in this space, at his permaculture mixed farm in Sweden. I mentioned him and a few other successful people in the regen ag space, like Gabe Brown and Geoff Lawton, with brief descriptions, in the recent thread about a long-running no-till no-herbicide farm here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24827234 Edit: Also, Aanandaa Farms, started and…

Another well-known long-running (20+ years) successful permaculture / regen ag farm in India is Krishna McKenzie's Solitude Farm, Auroville, Tamil Nadu. Again, mixed crops, herbs, fruit and other trees, multi-layer. On-site farm cafe with raw / local / vegan food. They also know well about and use local edible weeds as food, further reducing work and increasing efficiency - no need to even plant them, let alone cultivate! He has a video or two about that too, along with Nina Sengupta, who wrote the book Edible Weeds of the Auroville Region. He also does talks, local outreach and education, and has a good video channel on YouTube about it all.

Mentioned it before too, in that same recent thread:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24876047

Re: So you want to buy a farm?

#88

Post by jaclaz »

dirktheman wrote: post #71
driverdan wrote: post #20

I always laugh when someone who has never worked on a farm talks about buying one. Most farming is hard work, much harder than an office job. And most small farms do not make much money, especially if you don't know what you're doing. If you're thinking about it go get a job on one first before you buy anything.

I know some farmers and they all have one thing in common: they work around the clock, 7 days a week. No days off or vacations. Their farms might be worth millions, but it's also both their home and their job. Also, a lot of people don't get that a farm (anything other than subsistence farming) is a business. It requires careful long term planning, crop rotation, dealing with buyers, collectives, auctions, risk mitig…

In Italy we have an old saying:

"La terra è bassa."

(translates to "the earth is low" implying that to get food out of it you have to kneel and bend a lot, i.e. it is hard, hard, backbreaking work)

With animals, it is (IMHO) even harder, another saying (Tuscany) goes like:

"Le bestie non conoscono feste comandate"

(translates to "animals know nothing about holidays", it is a 7 day a week (from dawn to sunset) 365 days a year job)

Re: So you want to buy a farm?

#89

Post by zenxblr »

happy-go-lucky wrote: post #85
FlyingSnake wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First of all kudos for sharing your wonderful experience. I must say geography also helped you a lot with your experience. Your experience would've been much different if your farm was in Bidar or Anantpur. I would love to hear more about your journey and keep sharing your tales with us!

> Your experience would've been much different if your farm was in Bidar or Anantpur. I'm from the latter, own some ancestral land there. Here, we're always on the lookout for ways to counter the extreme aridity of the region. We know it's not easy and like asking the impossible.

Sameer Patil has effected a fairly amazing transformation at his farm somewhere up there I think. Take a look https://www.facebook.com/patilnaturefarms

Re: So you want to buy a farm?

#90

Post by Dylanfm »

PopeDotNinja wrote: post #59
raptorraver wrote: post #40

I'm starting to sell my city apartment this week and we are going to move to the country side to start a small scale farm! I've worked in the farm all my youth and this summer we lived on the place and did some small scale gardening. I don't have any (at least many) false thoughts about how cool and romantic it will be. It will be hard and frustrating at times but waay more fulfilling than the current tech job. We're…

How much land does one need to become self sufficient? Let's assume that means producing enough biomass to generate the resources necessary to have a surplus of food or money.

I prefer to aim for community sufficient, rather than self sufficient. You probably won't do a good job of being entirely self sufficient. A small healthy community could be, or almost.
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