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U.S. Exits Paris Climate Accord

scientificamerican.com

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Re: U.S. Exits Paris Climate Accord

#171

Post by abyssin »

noworriesnate wrote: post #65
originalvichy wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like this is a deflection and a critical reason why progress isn’t happening fast enough. Your house is already messy, and the need to clean it up is now. Not when China and a couple billion other people mess their house up. My country’s ambitious plans are shot down by members of parliament going for the kneejern ”but India and China...” response, and the net result would be no action if they were in power. L…

If we bring jobs back to the U.S., we will no longer be outsourcing our pollution production. The same jobs will produce less pollution in the U.S. than in China. Of course prices will go up for the goods being produced. So there is something we can do about China and India being major polluters.

Prices are low because we have lots of machines using cheap fossil energy working for us. If we have less machines working for us, we'll produce less goods, and we'll be less rich.

Re: U.S. Exits Paris Climate Accord

#172

Post by einpoklum »

bamboozled wrote: post #64

I hope I’m wrong but it seems the world may have to leave the United States in the 1950s where it currently plans to reside. Seriously, it’s time counties who want to improve the situation need move on from worrying about what the United sates is doing because it doesn’t look like much will be happening for a long time.

First order of business:

1. Drop the US dollar as a reserve currency.

2. Free the SWIFT system from subservience to US decrees.

Re: U.S. Exits Paris Climate Accord

#173

Post by UncleMeat »

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #32
originalvichy wrote: post #3

As a European this is the main fear I have during this election. 4 more years of inaction from the government of one of the biggest polluters in the world will really bite us in the ass. Not that I’m super proud of how we are doing in my country, but it can’t get worse.

US entrepreneurism kickstarted the electric vehicle transition (thx Elon1). Batteries prices are falling. PV is already incredibly cheap and getting cheaper. Coal is becoming increasingly uncompetitive. Nuclear is making a comeback, also thanks to US entrepreneurs. Science, Capitalism and entrepreneurship will be the unstoppable force that will solve our energy crisis, if western governments let them. Africa, India a…

> Science, Capitalism and entrepreneurship will be the unstoppable force that will solve our energy crisis, if western governments let them.

Yes, everybody knows that EVs received precisely zero government subsidy in terms of R&D, business loans, and consumer rebates. That free market did it all by itself. And we've got what... 1% of the cars on the road running on electric?

Re: U.S. Exits Paris Climate Accord

#175

Post by maxerickson »

macspoofing wrote: post #145
originalvichy wrote: post #3

As a European this is the main fear I have during this election. 4 more years of inaction from the government of one of the biggest polluters in the world will really bite us in the ass. Not that I’m super proud of how we are doing in my country, but it can’t get worse.

>4 more years of inaction from the government of one of the biggest polluters in the world will really bite us in the ass. But that's not the case. America is reducing its emissions greatly by shifting from coal to natural gas (which mirrors what Germany is doing, for example). Coal is ostensibly dead in US. If you look at the charts from Wikipedia [1][2], you'll see the US has cut emissions at about the same rate (o…

It's also almost cheaper to build new solar than to operate natural gas.

It doesn't require coordinated action to move away from coal and gas at that point.

Re: U.S. Exits Paris Climate Accord

#176

Post by adwww »

macspoofing wrote: post #145
originalvichy wrote: post #3

As a European this is the main fear I have during this election. 4 more years of inaction from the government of one of the biggest polluters in the world will really bite us in the ass. Not that I’m super proud of how we are doing in my country, but it can’t get worse.

>4 more years of inaction from the government of one of the biggest polluters in the world will really bite us in the ass. But that's not the case. America is reducing its emissions greatly by shifting from coal to natural gas (which mirrors what Germany is doing, for example). Coal is ostensibly dead in US. If you look at the charts from Wikipedia [1][2], you'll see the US has cut emissions at about the same rate (o…

This is what the UK did a number of years ago. At the time we got a lot of praise for dramatically cutting emissions.

The problem is, that change didn't effect anyone negatively, and thanks to cheaper gas imports it was essentially free.

Now that we are off coal, future cuts are going to be a lot harder.

Re: U.S. Exits Paris Climate Accord

#177

Post by trasz »

koheripbal wrote: post #40
originalvichy wrote: post #3

As a European this is the main fear I have during this election. 4 more years of inaction from the government of one of the biggest polluters in the world will really bite us in the ass. Not that I’m super proud of how we are doing in my country, but it can’t get worse.

The biggest issue with the Paris Accords is that China did not commit to begin any restrictions until 2030. ...and since they are both the world's largest CO2 emitter and world's fastest growing CO2 emitter, the Accords became a corporate strategy to just move more manufacturing to China (and other non-limited countries). Frankly, I think the Paris Accords does more harm than good by giving anyone the notion that we…

China is building nuclear power plants like crazy: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/china-build-4.... So, in a few years things should look much better there.

Re: U.S. Exits Paris Climate Accord

#178

Post by TeMPOraL »

mathh wrote: post #140
wwright wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m really not sure this is the case. For example, we know that we have far more than enough capacity to produce food for the entire world, we just simply don’t do it. Of course, Americans are very wasteful, and we can’t scale that amount of wastefulness to the entire planet.

Is it so hard on HN to use specific and appropriate verbs other than “to scale” for any idea related to something expanding or getting bigger ?

But why, if there's a perfectly good, appropriate enough, and concise term available? Being verbose does not scale.

Re: U.S. Exits Paris Climate Accord

#179

Post by giantg2 »

Ygg2 wrote: post #154
giantg2 wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You specifically mentioned electric cars in the US, of which Tesla is the largest producer. So this is a valid assumption to make. Do you have any information that would suggest a change in this model, such as GM or Ford sourcing their motors or batteries from China? What examples do you have of green tech exported from China that has found widespread adoption in China?

> You specifically mentioned electric cars in the US, of which Tesla is the largest producer I said "So if US goes all electric car, China would follow suit, etc." I didn't say if a single company in US goes electric car, China would follow suit. I quantified it as "all/most" not "exists". > What examples do you have of green tech exported from China that has found widespread adoption in China? Not green tech specifi…

"What China makes for US they also use a version of that internally."

You are implying that China would be producing the cars, or at least the primary components. But you have provided no support for this. Current production and sourcing partnerships show no evidence to support your implication. Even ICE vehicles in the US overwhelmingly have the engine and transmission built in countries other than China, with a large number being built in the US, Canada, and Mexico.

Re: U.S. Exits Paris Climate Accord

#180

Post by matheusmoreira »

mola wrote: post #78
koheripbal wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The biggest issue with the Paris Accords is that China did not commit to begin any restrictions until 2030. ...and since they are both the world's largest CO2 emitter and world's fastest growing CO2 emitter, the Accords became a corporate strategy to just move more manufacturing to China (and other non-limited countries). Frankly, I think the Paris Accords does more harm than good by giving anyone the notion that we…

You cannot hinder developing countries from the comfort of living in a develop country. The fact that China agreed to a year is amazing. If the US would have kept part of that deal then maybe we would've seen improvements. But now that the US basically proven to be untrustworthy, even towards allies, these kind of deals are just undoable anymore. This will end in tears

> now that the US basically proven to be untrustworthy

Was the US ever trustworthy?

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