Tech Workers Take to the Mountains, Bringing Silicon Valley with Them • Hacker News Board

Re: Tech Workers Take to the Mountains, Bringing Silicon Valley with Them

#131

Post by davidw » Tue, Nov 03, 2020, 1:27 AM UTC

pkaye wrote: post #126

iaw wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In 1978 California passed the ill-conceived Proposition 13 which encourages people to keep houses rather than sell them through lower tax rates for longer ownership. California has almost 40M residents and Oregon has a bit over 4M, even a fraction of those 40M going north to Oregon is going to overload the housing market there.

> even a fraction of those 40M going north to Oregon is going to overload the housing market there. Oregon just needs to build more housing.

Anyplace that people want to live should build more housing of all shapes and sizes - and not artificially restrict housing options with zoning.

Re: Tech Workers Take to the Mountains, Bringing Silicon Valley with Them

#132

Post by monoideism » Tue, Nov 03, 2020, 1:28 AM UTC

silicon2401 wrote: post #49

reaperducer wrote: post #39

People have been talking about this on HN for a few months now, and I never took it seriously since these threads are always filled with people quoting numbers saying it's not happening. That was until last month, when two tech workers from San Francisco moved into the neighborhood. Both have the same story: Their company went work-from-home when the pandemic started, then made it permanent, so the company employees…

That's what makes it appealing to a lot of people who have been living around millions of other people. Soon many of these places will no longer be cheap and far away from other people. It'll be interesting to see how today's cultural conflicts play out when the more left-leaning, urban remote workers move en masse to smaller, more right-leaning, less urban places.

The dispersal of bay area tech workers will be good for the country, if we can avoid breaking down in the immediate future.

SV had become a total thought bubble, with the average tech worker having either no conception or a very negative conception of how most of the country lives outside of the large urban areas.

Moving into areas with lots of moderates or conservatives will be a good learning experience. I don't expect people to change their ideology, but I do expect much more tolerance from them than what I've seen in recent years.

Re: Tech Workers Take to the Mountains, Bringing Silicon Valley with Them

#133

Post by azinman2 » Tue, Nov 03, 2020, 1:30 AM UTC

kenhwang wrote: post #130

azinman2 wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So right now it's 5pm PST, end of the work day for many. It's 8AM in Saigon. You really think people are going to work from midnight to 8am? And sometimes later in the morning depending on the situation? And this is going to be a massive trend?

If your company can operate on EST, yeah, the hours almost work out. Lines up even better on India Standard Time. For PST, central Europe is perfect. 6pm-2am workday is pretty doable.

The GP said "Especially in Southeast Asia," not Europe.

6pm-2am is doable if you're a) a very late night person, and b) without kids. I don't think this generalizes to a large percentage of people, and it can easily go well past 2am. It's less unreasonable to think people may still be working or responding to something at 8/9 or even 10pm PST, but if that's now 4/5/6am for someone in Europe, that's pretty rough. You'll also not be able to line up your meals very easily.

Re: Tech Workers Take to the Mountains, Bringing Silicon Valley with Them

#134

Post by tayo42 » Tue, Nov 03, 2020, 1:41 AM UTC

monoideism wrote: post #132

silicon2401 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what makes it appealing to a lot of people who have been living around millions of other people. Soon many of these places will no longer be cheap and far away from other people. It'll be interesting to see how today's cultural conflicts play out when the more left-leaning, urban remote workers move en masse to smaller, more right-leaning, less urban places.

The dispersal of bay area tech workers will be good for the country, if we can avoid breaking down in the immediate future. SV had become a total thought bubble, with the average tech worker having either no conception or a very negative conception of how most of the country lives outside of the large urban areas. Moving into areas with lots of moderates or conservatives will be a good learning experience. I don't ex…

I grew up in an area with conservatives. I remember the slurs I was called quite clearly. I don't need to go back to that experience. Give me a break with a comment like this.

Re: Tech Workers Take to the Mountains, Bringing Silicon Valley with Them

#135

Post by kenhwang » Tue, Nov 03, 2020, 1:42 AM UTC

azinman2 wrote: post #133

kenhwang wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your company can operate on EST, yeah, the hours almost work out. Lines up even better on India Standard Time. For PST, central Europe is perfect. 6pm-2am workday is pretty doable.

The GP said "Especially in Southeast Asia," not Europe. 6pm-2am is doable if you're a) a very late night person, and b) without kids. I don't think this generalizes to a large percentage of people, and it can easily go well past 2am. It's less unreasonable to think people may still be working or responding to something at 8/9 or even 10pm PST, but if that's now 4/5/6am for someone in Europe, that's pretty rough. You'…

Definitely not for a large percentage of people. Just a significant percentage of the IC engineering workforce. Especially the digital nomad types.

People with kids aren't going to relocate their family internationally unless they already had family roots there.

Anecdotally, the people I personally know that love SE Asia and would seriously consider or already did WFH from there were all in the 20-30s age group and had no problem maintaining US working times. The biggest draw of SE Asia other than the super low COL is that its beautiful outside. The outdoors is best enjoyed during daylight, so the timezone offset is a plus for them.

Re: Tech Workers Take to the Mountains, Bringing Silicon Valley with Them

#136

Post by throw0101a » Tue, Nov 03, 2020, 1:43 AM UTC

throwaway0a5e wrote: post #76

silicon2401 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what makes it appealing to a lot of people who have been living around millions of other people. Soon many of these places will no longer be cheap and far away from other people. It'll be interesting to see how today's cultural conflicts play out when the more left-leaning, urban remote workers move en masse to smaller, more right-leaning, less urban places.

It's not about left right. It's about rural vs urban and have money vs not. Everything that's terrible and soul crushing about a tourism economy is about to happen to random places that have thus far been spared that fate.

> It's not about left right. It's about rural vs urban and have money vs not.

There's a high correlation between population and political in the US:

> There's a decisive break between Democratic and Republican support at a population density of 800 persons/per square mile.

* https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2013-04-01/how-the-d...

Re: Tech Workers Take to the Mountains, Bringing Silicon Valley with Them

#137

Post by kenhwang » Tue, Nov 03, 2020, 1:54 AM UTC

nendroid wrote: post #66

umeshunni wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a narrow slice between San Mateo and Santa Clara that has great weather. Anything North or West is cold and foggy. South Bay and East Bay pushes 100F for 3 months a year. And this is before you consider that we now have 1-2 months of smoke season.

For the south bay it's not 3 months of the year, 100F lasts for like 2-3 weeks at most (actually realistically it's more like 95-100). It's the same for socal. Socal has about 2-3 weeks in the summer where the temps become sweltering. Even within LA the temperatures vary, the closer you are to the coastline the better the weather. I know because I grew up in the south bay, I lived in SF for 2 years and lived in LA fo…

The best weather really lies between Socal and Norcal: SLO and SB. Their biggest weakness was always the lack of local jobs.

Re: Tech Workers Take to the Mountains, Bringing Silicon Valley with Them

#138

Post by Xcelerate » Tue, Nov 03, 2020, 1:56 AM UTC

Anecdotally, I just moved from the Bay Area to Asheville and am taking my tech job with me. So, could be true... Real estate there is crazy right now. The local agents say houses have been selling very quickly, often sight unseen to California buyers.

Re: Tech Workers Take to the Mountains, Bringing Silicon Valley with Them

#139

Post by ulfw » Tue, Nov 03, 2020, 2:00 AM UTC

code4tee wrote: post #59

I saw a great quote recently that said something like “Everyone loves work from home until you lose a deal to the competition that turned up to your customer in person.” There’s an element of truth to this. Best advice I’ve heard is to say the draw for living in a city may go away but you need to be close. Living in the middle of nowhere isn’t going to look like such a great idea when people start gathering together…

Not everyone is a salesman though. Why would an engineer need to be in an office coding away so "he can turn up to his customer"?

Re: Tech Workers Take to the Mountains, Bringing Silicon Valley with Them

#140

Post by p1necone » Tue, Nov 03, 2020, 2:00 AM UTC

kjs3 wrote: post #115

silicon2401 wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't reduce things to one dimension, I agree, but I disagree that left vs right is unimportant. When largely liberal city people migrate into largely conservative places, there's gonna be some conflict. Not to mention a lot of these tech workers are liberal and have money, so they'll be empowered to support changes that the locals may not be on board with but also may not have the means to combat effectively.

I agree with your first two sentences, then I think you loose your way. SFO is a 'liberal' city, but the idea the tech people are majority liberal as well needs a strong does of supporting evidence. My own observation is that much like the rest of the rest of the populace, it's a spectrum. I have talked to many SFO folks looking to move out of there specifically because they want to be somewhere 'conservative', usual…

You only have to look at any slightly politically charged topic on HN to see that there are plenty of far far right wingers in tech.

Edit: see I'm even being downvoted by them now :D