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Faster Growth, Fairer Growth: Policies for a High Road, High Performance Economy

niskanencenter.org

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Re: Faster Growth, Fairer Growth: Policies for a High Road, High Performance Economy

#11

Post by mjevans »

WalterBright wrote: post #5
abj wrote: post #3

Some great, sane ideas on improving copyright law [1]. The amount of resources the current copyright laws waste is surprisingly high. "For software, the direct costs every year of defending infringement suits from so-called "nonpracticing entities" – better known as patent trolls – come to more than 10 percent of total annual R&D spending by all U.S. businesses." [1] https://www.niskanencenter.org/faster_fairer/liber…

I've become more and more convinced that copyright laws do not promote progress of useful arts and sciences. The most obvious example is the incredible success of free and open software. Are people really going to stop writing books, composing music, painting pictures, etc, without copyright protection? Not a chance!

Copyright is mostly a monopoly situation. I (and probably most others) are OK with Trademark use as a form of consumer protection.

Automatic copyright for some reasonable time, say 10 years, could be automatic and free. Renewals past that time (E.G. in 10 year blocks) should be exponentially more costly.

Re: Faster Growth, Fairer Growth: Policies for a High Road, High Performance Economy

#12

Post by bigcorp-slave »

WalterBright wrote: post #4

> At the same time that the major factors expanding the economic pie were losing momentum, other powerful forces emerged that would push toward dividing the pie more unequally The framing of the issue influences what conclusions one draws. Here, the authors think of the economy as a "pie" created by "factors" that gets "divided up". What naturally follows is that if some get a bigger "slice" than others, it is inhere…

Bob starts with 11 units of utility. Fred starts with 2. It costs 1 unit of utility to exist. Each of Bob and Fred invest their remaining utility in the utility market, which grows at 10% per year regardless of what either of them do. 25 years later, Bob has 109 units of utility, and Fred has roughly 12 units of utility. At the beginning of this thought experiment, Bob had 5.5x the utility units of Fred. At the end, he had more than 9x.

This is a simple thought experiment that I hope illuminates something important: in an economy where there is year over year growth, inequality grows by default as a function of exposure to the market. Here, Bob starts with more and can be more exposed to the market. In this example, Bob started with 5.5x more assets - but in America today, the top 10% of households have a median net worth of $1.6m, and the 40th-60th percentile of households have a median net worth of $88k, a multiplier of 18x (note: this data is from 2016).

Most Americans have little to no exposure to the market, while the richest 10% own 84% of stocks. There are many factors driving inequality, and I don’t think anyone would argue that some people are more economically productive than others. But it’s not the case that inequality in the United States is purely a function of hard work by talented people - there are very significant structural factors.

Re: Faster Growth, Fairer Growth: Policies for a High Road, High Performance Economy

#13

Post by qppo »

WalterBright wrote: post #8
WalterBright wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've become more and more convinced that copyright laws do not promote progress of useful arts and sciences. The most obvious example is the incredible success of free and open software. Are people really going to stop writing books, composing music, painting pictures, etc, without copyright protection? Not a chance!

Consider rock musicians. Suppose there were two concerts, one playing a Beatles song with the Beatles performing it (yes I know two of them are gone). Another venue is playing the same songs, just as well, but by a cover band. Which concert is going to make boatloads of money, and which will barely be able to pay the electric bill? Copyright has nothing to do with it.

What if there were two albums, entitled "Beatles Greatest Hits" and "Best of the Beatles" and the former is a compilation album and the latter is a solo album by former Beatles drummer, Pete Best.

If a fan buys the second without realizing it is not a compilation album, should the Beatles not be able to defend their name being used to sell it? Or profit off of it?

Re: Faster Growth, Fairer Growth: Policies for a High Road, High Performance Economy

#14

Post by djrobstep »

WalterBright wrote: post #4

> At the same time that the major factors expanding the economic pie were losing momentum, other powerful forces emerged that would push toward dividing the pie more unequally The framing of the issue influences what conclusions one draws. Here, the authors think of the economy as a "pie" created by "factors" that gets "divided up". What naturally follows is that if some get a bigger "slice" than others, it is inhere…

This is lazy libertarianism at its worst.

> But a free market economy is not a pie.

Of course it is. Wealth is exclusionary control over finite resources, and coercive control over others (particularly their labor). My ownership of my car literally means the right to exclude others from the usage of it.

> Bob creating more wealth than Fred does not mean that Bob took it from Fred.

Yes it does. Property law violently denied it from Fred, on behalf of Bob.

> There's nothing unfair about Bob creating more than Fred.

Yes there is. Wealth isn't creation, it's about control (ask any open source developer about this). It's about Bob forcing Fred to work for sub minimum wage in his chain of stores because Bob inherited them from Bob Snr.

Re: Faster Growth, Fairer Growth: Policies for a High Road, High Performance Economy

#17

Post by freddie_mercury »

WalterBright wrote: post #4

> At the same time that the major factors expanding the economic pie were losing momentum, other powerful forces emerged that would push toward dividing the pie more unequally The framing of the issue influences what conclusions one draws. Here, the authors think of the economy as a "pie" created by "factors" that gets "divided up". What naturally follows is that if some get a bigger "slice" than others, it is inhere…

To make this something other than a pedantic correction, you'd need to show how your framing would materially change anything they've written.

So what would be different?

Re: Faster Growth, Fairer Growth: Policies for a High Road, High Performance Economy

#18

Post by ttul »

mjevans wrote: post #11
WalterBright wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've become more and more convinced that copyright laws do not promote progress of useful arts and sciences. The most obvious example is the incredible success of free and open software. Are people really going to stop writing books, composing music, painting pictures, etc, without copyright protection? Not a chance!

Copyright is mostly a monopoly situation. I (and probably most others) are OK with Trademark use as a form of consumer protection. Automatic copyright for some reasonable time, say 10 years, could be automatic and free. Renewals past that time (E.G. in 10 year blocks) should be exponentially more costly.

Even better: auction off the copyright renewals. Let the market determine the true value of the copyright.

Re: Faster Growth, Fairer Growth: Policies for a High Road, High Performance Economy

#19

Post by TylerE »

WalterBright wrote: post #8
WalterBright wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've become more and more convinced that copyright laws do not promote progress of useful arts and sciences. The most obvious example is the incredible success of free and open software. Are people really going to stop writing books, composing music, painting pictures, etc, without copyright protection? Not a chance!

Consider rock musicians. Suppose there were two concerts, one playing a Beatles song with the Beatles performing it (yes I know two of them are gone). Another venue is playing the same songs, just as well, but by a cover band. Which concert is going to make boatloads of money, and which will barely be able to pay the electric bill? Copyright has nothing to do with it.

You'd be surprised how lucrative tribute bands can be.

Some draw better than surviving members of the group they're covering.

Re: Faster Growth, Fairer Growth: Policies for a High Road, High Performance Economy

#20

Post by edmundsauto »

djrobstep wrote: post #14
WalterBright wrote: post #4

> At the same time that the major factors expanding the economic pie were losing momentum, other powerful forces emerged that would push toward dividing the pie more unequally The framing of the issue influences what conclusions one draws. Here, the authors think of the economy as a "pie" created by "factors" that gets "divided up". What naturally follows is that if some get a bigger "slice" than others, it is inhere…

This is lazy libertarianism at its worst. > But a free market economy is not a pie. Of course it is. Wealth is exclusionary control over finite resources, and coercive control over others (particularly their labor). My ownership of my car literally means the right to exclude others from the usage of it. > Bob creating more wealth than Fred does not mean that Bob took it from Fred. Yes it does. Property law violently…

Do you think there is difference in peoples ability to compound wealth?
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