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Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

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Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#101

Post by runawaybottle »

arka2147483647 wrote: post #87
Cass wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's plenty of political views so toxic and harmful they don't deserve civility. An easy litmus test: are you advocating harm to a person for merely existing in the world, living with the skin color and sexuality they were born with, or making choices that don't harm anyone else? Then I have no interest in hearing your toxic and hateful opinion and I sure hope you'll be afraid to voice it around me. It's a great t…

Im not american, But i feel that on the long term the list of ”too wrong to discuss” opinion tends to grow, until you reach the point where civil and peacefull discussion becomes impossible. To me it seems this is the road U.S. is walking on.

Right.

The logical end to all of this exists in places in this world. You cannot share your opinion on Islam in some parts of this world, you’ll die. You cannot speak out against the government in China, you will be in jail.

It’s called political persecution. We are on the proverbial slippery slope.

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#102

Post by brsg »

another_sock wrote: post #60
tom_ wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Such as...?

various aspects of IQ, demeanor, education, work ethic, surroundings, and a whole host of other variables, some external some internal. Of course the majority of people on HN and in the public will revert to weeping and gnashing of teeth rather than acknowledge this obvious fact, because the majority of people on HN and in the public implicitly tie human worth to economic output and intelligence (which is the actuall…

I'm not going to "cancel" you, but it's a little telling that your example of a moderate view immediately went there.

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#103

Post by youareostriches »

tremon wrote: post #75
youareostriches wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, sorry. Ostracizing others is absolutely not equivalent to attempted murder.

In this discussion, I don't see why they're not equivalent. We're talking about reasons why people hide their political beliefs, not abstract ethics.

Ethics applies here just as well. You are trying to equivocate the actions of those who actually attempt to kill those who disagree politically (aka “terrorism”) with attempts at eliminating platforms for wide dissemination of speech.

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#104

Post by buro9 »

factorialboy wrote: post #36

My company got spammed by Expensify CEOs political views. Some non Americans complained about receiving the irrelevant email. Some Americans were targeting even that. Apparently foreigners have no right to NOT RECEIVE political endorsements that mirrors their political views. Your politics is too toxic. Sorry but it has to be said.

And just after I read this on HN I see this shared by a fellow brit asking WTF https://www.thedailybeast.com/biden-camp-cancels-austin-texa... and indeed... it's hard to comprehend of this level of voter and campaign intimidation like this anywhere. When I've read things like this in the past it's been in failed states.

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#105

Post by morelisp »

morelisp wrote: post #57
dnsld wrote: post #12

we're posting Cato Institute links now?

Cato's leadership struggle in 2012 took it from a strongly-right-leaning but fundamentally intelligent and rational policy organization, to one step above the John Birch Society and a bare GOP stump organization. I don't care one way or another about banning, but yeah, people really should not put any weight into what comes out of it today.

I'm not complaining about the downvotes but given that my comment contains significant substance about the Cato Institute, I would appreciate more feedback. Are you downvoting because you think the leadership struggle in 2012 didn't affect it, or because you also think the JBS is a serious policy organization?

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#106

Post by nautilus12 »

Cass wrote: post #50
ColanR wrote: post #2

And this is why it's so important to maintain basic civility to everyone, regardless of political views.

There's plenty of political views so toxic and harmful they don't deserve civility. An easy litmus test: are you advocating harm to a person for merely existing in the world, living with the skin color and sexuality they were born with, or making choices that don't harm anyone else? Then I have no interest in hearing your toxic and hateful opinion and I sure hope you'll be afraid to voice it around me. It's a great t…

"There's plenty of political views so toxic and harmful they don't deserve civility."

The people that you think don't deserve civility in this scenario literally have the exact same viewpoint. This is the disconnect and it goes both ways.

Unless its straight up illegal, civility should always apply.

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#107

Post by TravHatesMe »

foepys wrote: post #21

I honestly think that social networks where you connect the whole world were a bad idea. Basing it on ads and thus engagement made it toxic. Political left and right both formed extreme wings that attack moderate opinions for not being extreme enough. The right is often threatening violence while the left is trying to get you fired from your job. We need to get rid of engagement algorithms and actively try to counter…

> Political left and right both formed extreme wings that attack moderate opinions for not being extreme enough

Very well said. I hate all extremes of politics. I like asking questions and being critical. What I have noticed is that critical thinking is attacked viciously from both sides. Asking questions that go against your side's "hard fact" is greeted with intense hostility and vitriol. I would imagine that this behavior is encouraged because it teaches people to not ask questions and follow the herd.

Forming your own opinions, coming to your own conclusions, asking your own question -- this is all so offensive nowadays. It is sad because often there is real social risk in saying something that might offend the left/right. If you live in a community that heavily leans to one side, you are scared of stating your own opinions because people could shun you. This social punishment could extend to your children -- what parent would want to take that risk?

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#108

Post by viraptor »

mc32 wrote: post #88
viraptor wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not referring to framing something ambiguous. I mean for example people openly discussing final solution to Jew problem. Are you suggesting basic civility and discussion about the issue with them?

That's disingenuous. That is an unusual extreme view held by neo-nazis AND extreme leftists (nation of islam types). We're talking about people not feeling comfortable having a debate over abortion (it's a third rail on either side to try and establish a time when a foetus becomes a recognized being). This is something we should be curious to establish a benchmark for. Both sides fear that if we establish a number of…

I literally qualified my post with "once the views become too extreme". It's exactly what this thread is about. (I agree with your position on non-extreme views enough)

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#109

Post by offshore4432 »

morelisp wrote: post #98
nautilus12 wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that the rubrik for interaction is "being yelled at" or "attacked", and not just "being approached in civil discussion" of any kind is telling of how one side has lost site of the whole point of "civics"

> one side has lost [sight] of the whole point of "civics" Today the president voiced approval for his supporters literally running his opponents' supporters off the road.

If you actually look at the video closely, the Trump supporters' vehicles kept their own lanes. The other vehicles drove into their lanes.

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#110

Post by another_sock »

brsg wrote: post #102
another_sock wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

various aspects of IQ, demeanor, education, work ethic, surroundings, and a whole host of other variables, some external some internal. Of course the majority of people on HN and in the public will revert to weeping and gnashing of teeth rather than acknowledge this obvious fact, because the majority of people on HN and in the public implicitly tie human worth to economic output and intelligence (which is the actuall…

I'm not going to "cancel" you, but it's a little telling that your example of a moderate view immediately went there.

I don't care about you trying to cancel me lol that's why this is a sock account, but it's even more telling that you think basic descriptive (not prescriptive) observations about reality are not moderate.
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