How to deal with extreme physical pain • Hacker News Board

Re: How to deal with extreme physical pain

#271

Post by travbrack » Sat, Oct 31, 2020, 10:35 AM UTC

eslaught wrote: post #172

banana_giraffe wrote: post #12

I have a chronic condition that causes pain. One of the things I've learned, in as much as I can, is I don't tell anyone. I'd rather be rude than explain I'm in pain. Not because I don't appreciate sympathy. Not because I'm ashamed. It's because I don't want your advice on how to make the pain go away or to deal with it. I'm tired of advice. I've got too much advice. I try things, I research issues. I talk to doctors…

I was rereading The Lord of the Rings a while back and one of the things that struck me was how seriously the characters take the giving of advice. In retrospect I think this is one of the biggest blind spots of American culture in general. We act like advice is cheap or even free, both in the giving and in receiving. It's not. Even when solicited. I think we'd all be healthier if we were slower to give advice, even…

I didn't notice this on my recent read. Can you think of an example?

Re: How to deal with extreme physical pain

#272

Post by kranner » Sat, Oct 31, 2020, 10:35 AM UTC

headstorm wrote: post #266

eric_b wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the risk of being a jerk: Have you read the book The Mindbody Prescription by Dr. Sarno? [1] I sound like an infomercial pitchman but that book changed my life. I had a massive structural issue that was either going mean a knee replacement or dealing with "you won't walk right ever again". Well, it turns out there was a third option. [1] https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FOTRPJQ/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?... It sounds woo…

I was completely ready for that book to change my life after reading so many glowing testimonials. It did nothing, though I felt worse after reading it a few times, because it was supposed to be so transformative. I guess the mind-body prescription isn't prescribed for celiac disease or my other health issues, because finding out that I had those conditions was the key, not Dr. Sarno's advice.

Sarno's book didn't help me either. I wasn't even sure what the point was, until I watched a documentary called "All the Rage" (available on Amazon Prime in the US) on Sarno and his method, which at least clarified the whole thing for me.

One of the things Sarno advises before taking him on is that every other medical condition that could possibly be relevant has been investigated and ruled out.

Re: How to deal with extreme physical pain

#273

Post by ozim » Sat, Oct 31, 2020, 10:37 AM UTC

I am just connecting dots here with intermittent fasting article that was posted somewhere yesterday.

Scott is writing about cognitive dissonance where you feel the pain and you just want to stop physical therapy. But going through the pain and doing therapy is going to make it all better in the long term.

Main point would be staying in bed all days is easier than exercising, not eating whole day is harder than eating sweets all day, going through more pain to relieve it later is harder as well. Unfortunately we are mostly wired to get short term benefits right now and a person has to really put in effort to go for long term benefits.

Re: How to deal with extreme physical pain

#274

Post by treeman79 » Sat, Oct 31, 2020, 10:42 AM UTC

DoreenMichele wrote: post #178

wutbrodo wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If people care, they do what actually helps you rather than insisting you make them feel good for superficial bullshit that only adds to your suffering. This is a very simplistic way to look at people. A lot of people are misinformed or not thoughtful or don't fully understand your experience or frankly not that bright. The idea that people who genuinely care never do any damage is beyond ludicrous.

That's a ludicrous interpretation of my remark. People who actually care will be okay with being told "This isn't helping. Please just stop." But that's not what the vast majority of people do. The vast majority of people want it acknowledged that they are good people because they care about you and are trying to help and all this shit. If they cared, they would drop it when asked instead of doubling down on trying t…

I find it’s often due to people getting frustrated and not knowing his deal with it in an emotionally helpful way.

See it in kids constantly, adults often.

Kids getting mad at the cat for not liking being dressed in doll clothes.

Yes you care about the cat. However now everyone including the cat is unhappy.

Childish behavior, except it still hurts when loved ones get mad at you for not recovering fast enough.

Parents offered me some pills (blood thinners) that might solve some problems.

They got very upset when I refused without a doctors consent.

Only thing I wanted from them was emotional support. Instead I had go cut them off for a year.

All because they couldn’t fix me.

Re: How to deal with extreme physical pain

#275

Post by draw_down » Sat, Oct 31, 2020, 10:43 AM UTC

ternaryoperator wrote: post #140

banana_giraffe wrote: post #12

I have a chronic condition that causes pain. One of the things I've learned, in as much as I can, is I don't tell anyone. I'd rather be rude than explain I'm in pain. Not because I don't appreciate sympathy. Not because I'm ashamed. It's because I don't want your advice on how to make the pain go away or to deal with it. I'm tired of advice. I've got too much advice. I try things, I research issues. I talk to doctors…

Re the reactions to your pain, I think there is a belief deeply embedded in the American psyche that most any problem can be solved. And mentioning a difficult problem brings out this aspect. In almost all cases, I like this quality and the underlying optimism it implies, but I also understand how it can be annoying and often come across as unconsciously insensitive. Sometimes, expressions of sympathy are all that's…

I don’t think the root of it is what you’re describing. It’s just plain old fear of death.

If your pain can be fixed, it means you aren’t at risk of just keeling over dead one day. Except that’s exactly what will happen. And in all such matters, “you” means me, “for whom the bell tolls”-style.

Re: How to deal with extreme physical pain

#276

Post by treeman79 » Sat, Oct 31, 2020, 10:44 AM UTC

geetee wrote: post #202

DoreenMichele wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a ludicrous interpretation of my remark. People who actually care will be okay with being told "This isn't helping. Please just stop." But that's not what the vast majority of people do. The vast majority of people want it acknowledged that they are good people because they care about you and are trying to help and all this shit. If they cared, they would drop it when asked instead of doubling down on trying t…

Based on other comments, I was under the impression that some people wanted zero unsolicited feedback. This instead sounds like you don't want people to keep offering suggestions after you tell them to stop. The former would make for a really cold society. The latter is completely understandable. I would tell the repeat offenders to fuck right off.

Support groups are a good place. Lots of forums dedicated to most chronic conditions. Much safer to ask advice in those places.

Re: How to deal with extreme physical pain

#277

Post by draw_down » Sat, Oct 31, 2020, 10:45 AM UTC

f2000 wrote: post #155

A few years ago I fell and broke my elbow. It was a mess and had to have emergency surgery to put it all back together. After surgery I'm sent home with a "ball" around my neck that is a reservoir for some pain meds that are being fed into my body via a catheter that was threaded into a vein in my neck. So I am sitting on my recliner a few hours after the surgery , awake but groggy. Anesthesiologist calls me on my ce…

Well, that’s just shit medical care.

Re: How to deal with extreme physical pain

#278

Post by bollu » Sat, Oct 31, 2020, 10:49 AM UTC

banana_giraffe wrote: post #12

I have a chronic condition that causes pain. One of the things I've learned, in as much as I can, is I don't tell anyone. I'd rather be rude than explain I'm in pain. Not because I don't appreciate sympathy. Not because I'm ashamed. It's because I don't want your advice on how to make the pain go away or to deal with it. I'm tired of advice. I've got too much advice. I try things, I research issues. I talk to doctors…

How ought one respond? I struggle with responding to challenges outside of offering "problem solving" solutions, or sympathetic noises. What would /actually help/?

Re: How to deal with extreme physical pain

#279

Post by JohnBooty » Sat, Oct 31, 2020, 11:11 AM UTC

zdragnar wrote: post #5

I was diagnosed with fibromyalgia ~15 years ago. Since then, having started an immunosuppressive for something else and it seemed to help with the pain- now the doctors think it is psoriatic arthritis. I am in constant, mild pain. Some days it is nearly, but not quite debilitating. Some people think I am making it up, exaggerating, or that it is all in my head. There is no certain test for either condition- in partic…

Your story is so much like my partner's, I had to wonder if they had a secret HN account and wrote this post.

With her initial diagnosis of fibro, we were... extremely disheartened to say the least. Professionals and laypeople alike hear that word and generally think of it as a made-up or at least psychosomatic disease.

I get a little bit of that, even from professionals, when I mention ADHD. Multiply that by 10 and that's roughly what we experienced with fibro, when that was their diagnosis.

Re: How to deal with extreme physical pain

#280

Post by throwaway_pdp09 » Sat, Oct 31, 2020, 11:17 AM UTC

bollu wrote: post #278

banana_giraffe wrote: post #12

I have a chronic condition that causes pain. One of the things I've learned, in as much as I can, is I don't tell anyone. I'd rather be rude than explain I'm in pain. Not because I don't appreciate sympathy. Not because I'm ashamed. It's because I don't want your advice on how to make the pain go away or to deal with it. I'm tired of advice. I've got too much advice. I try things, I research issues. I talk to doctors…

How ought one respond? I struggle with responding to challenges outside of offering "problem solving" solutions, or sympathetic noises. What would /actually help/?

It's different for different people, so the answer is, find out what the other person wants and give that.

In my case, give me nothing, no sympathy, no opportunities to talk, no anything. I deal with stuff by not thinking about it, tuning it out. If someone tries to 'help' with suggestions, they're forcing me think about it and the huge chunk of my life I've lost to it. That hurts deeply.

So, find out first. If someone wants to talk they will, if not, don't bring it up.

Generally speaking, don't offer fucking stupid suggestions ("have you seen a doctor?"). Don't tell me repeatedly doing X is the right thing to do when I know it will make things worse (happens rarely but is very annoying).

Don't offer me psychic healing, or offer to pray for me (unless you've found that that person is open to that. I am not and it will infuriate me).

HTH!