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The Corporatization of Nursing Homes

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Re: The Corporatization of Nursing Homes

#61
Timely. In Canada today, the leader of the federal opposition party talked about the possibility of ending for-profit care homes nationally[1][2] and some provincial parties are very bullish on the idea.[3]

[1] https://toronto.citynews.ca/video/2020/10/29/ndp-calls-for-f...

[2] https://ipolitics.ca/2020/10/29/singh-joins-ontario-counterp...

[3] https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/ontario-ndp-plan-chan...

Re: The Corporatization of Nursing Homes

#62
post #30
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why people call it a pyramid scheme. The breakdown of single-earner families means kids and seniors get institutional care. And there isn’t enough money to socialize care as good as your family.

> The breakdown of single-earner families means kids and seniors get institutional care. And there isn’t enough money to socialize care as good as your family. I guess we'd save a lot of money if we just had family structures more like people in asian countries.

wouldn't that lead to a lot of job losses in the nursing homes / facilities sectors?

Re: The Corporatization of Nursing Homes

#63
post #62
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The breakdown of single-earner families means kids and seniors get institutional care. And there isn’t enough money to socialize care as good as your family. I guess we'd save a lot of money if we just had family structures more like people in asian countries.

wouldn't that lead to a lot of job losses in the nursing homes / facilities sectors?

Yeah. It isn't worth people making bad decisions to support other people's jobs. A key part of what makes a job a job is the worker, in some sense, creating more value for others than the personal cost to themselves.

If people are better off doing something for themselves, then it is a net win if they do. The nursing home employees can go and do something else.

Re: The Corporatization of Nursing Homes

#64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> also seen healthy but less able older folks put in homes so that their kids could collect their inheritances and sell off everything else... Not sure what you mean by this, but putting someone in a skilled nursing facility costs about 10,000/month nominally. The "Deficit Reduction Act" of 2005 (thanks Bush), requires a 5 year look-back period for transactions to family members. Meaning that if a resident spends dow…

> putting someone in a skilled nursing facility costs about 10,000/month nominally Who on earth is able to afford this? Everywhere I look there are nursing homes full of ordinary people. I can't believe more than 0.1% of these people are literally able to afford $10,000/month. People live in those places for 20 years sometimes. That's $24,000,000. It just doesn't add up, dude. I think the actual cost is way, way, way…

You added an extra 0, $10,000/month x 20 years = $2,400,000. Still a lot of money however.

Re: The Corporatization of Nursing Homes

#65
post #36

It's mind-blowing that we live like this. We forced every adult into being a single atomic worker by completely eliminating jobs and benefits that enable single earners to care for their entire family (through the "unpaid" domestic work of the wife). Then, when we need to actually care for our families, we outsource that to the private sector, so that other atomic worker units can do the job for us. We have to do thi…

Women gained freedom, aka ability to earn income.

Women also lost freedom. They went from not having the choice to work to not having the choice to not work.

Re: The Corporatization of Nursing Homes

#66

When my wife (46) and I found out that she was terminally ill, I promised her that I'd never let her end up in a Nursing/Hospice home. She'll get care at home. When the time comes, she'll die at home, too. Myself, our adult daughter, and close friends have all banded together to make sure that she never ends up in a home. We reaffirmed this after Covid hit. If she goes into a hospice care facility, I'll never see her…

The other day I heard a story about a man who decided to kill his elderly father as the old man was too weak for productive work and the son considered him to be a burden on himself and his own kids. He built a large box out of wood. The box had wheels and door with a padlock on it. He shoved his father inside and locked him up. He wheeled the box to the edge of a cliff where he intended to toss the box on to the rocks a hundred meters below. As he was about to send it over the edge, his old man piped up from inside.

"You know you can go ahead and toss me off this cliff, but you should really keep the box. Your kids may have need of it when you get to be old like me."

Re: The Corporatization of Nursing Homes

#67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very few people want to take care of their parents

I've seen our family share the burden among siblings over time. My SO's family often rotated duties too. This was more practical when there were many kids and the elderly didn't have as many years in need of assistance. In hindsight it looks like it was a blessing and a curse. More time with them but weighed heavily on the mothers and daughters of all ages.

Having multiple (more than 2) children is a pyramid scheme. It only works at times of population explosion.

Re: The Corporatization of Nursing Homes

#68

When my wife (46) and I found out that she was terminally ill, I promised her that I'd never let her end up in a Nursing/Hospice home. She'll get care at home. When the time comes, she'll die at home, too. Myself, our adult daughter, and close friends have all banded together to make sure that she never ends up in a home. We reaffirmed this after Covid hit. If she goes into a hospice care facility, I'll never see her…

> also seen healthy but less able older folks put in homes so that their kids could collect their inheritances and sell off everything else... Not sure what you mean by this, but putting someone in a skilled nursing facility costs about 10,000/month nominally. The "Deficit Reduction Act" of 2005 (thanks Bush), requires a 5 year look-back period for transactions to family members. Meaning that if a resident spends dow…

In Poland, the rule is that basically if you and sibilings can afford to pay for the nursing home of your parent, there is no state assistance. The state only kicks in if the family is too poor to cover the costs. The rationale behind it being probably that caring for parents is the responsibility of family, not state.

Re: The Corporatization of Nursing Homes

#69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> also seen healthy but less able older folks put in homes so that their kids could collect their inheritances and sell off everything else... Not sure what you mean by this, but putting someone in a skilled nursing facility costs about 10,000/month nominally. The "Deficit Reduction Act" of 2005 (thanks Bush), requires a 5 year look-back period for transactions to family members. Meaning that if a resident spends dow…

> putting someone in a skilled nursing facility costs about 10,000/month nominally Who on earth is able to afford this? Everywhere I look there are nursing homes full of ordinary people. I can't believe more than 0.1% of these people are literally able to afford $10,000/month. People live in those places for 20 years sometimes. That's $24,000,000. It just doesn't add up, dude. I think the actual cost is way, way, way…

Here in Germany such facilities will cost around 1500-3000 EUR per month. This is still way more money then most people can stem, so they pay this typically with a combination of

* pension and social security (nursing case security) * income of the children * sale of real estate and other property of the invalid person

Yes, nursing facilities are damned expansive. But 10,000 USD/month, that's something almost nobody would be able to pay here.

Re: The Corporatization of Nursing Homes

#70

When my wife (46) and I found out that she was terminally ill, I promised her that I'd never let her end up in a Nursing/Hospice home. She'll get care at home. When the time comes, she'll die at home, too. Myself, our adult daughter, and close friends have all banded together to make sure that she never ends up in a home. We reaffirmed this after Covid hit. If she goes into a hospice care facility, I'll never see her…

Sorry about your wife. It sucks to go through with that. Let me give you the other side of the story. My father is slowly succumbing due to frontal-temporal dementia. In the span of 10 years he's gone from a social, independent man to a an extremely mentally challenged man with cognitive capacity of a 1 year old child. He is prone to ever increasing psychotic fits of violence and actual epileptic fits. Medication hel…

Yes. It is the most difficult thing.

There are no Hollywood movies about this, for a reason.

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