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‘Culture wars’ are fought by tiny minority – UK study

theguardian.com

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Re: ‘Culture wars’ are fought by tiny minority – UK study

#361

Post by cabraca »

Miner49er wrote: post #334
cabraca wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's due to a bunch of systemic problems and America's history of racism and slavery. How do you explain then, that asian-americans (on average) outearn whites, have a higher SAT score and are less likly to be in prison? They have been impacted by racist policies too: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internment_of_Japanese_America... > This of course will lead more black people to turn to crime, because they have less…

> How do you explain then, that asian-americans (on average) outearn whites, have a higher SAT score and are less likly to be in prison? They have been impacted by racist policies too: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internment_of_Japanese_America ... It's ridiculous to say that Asian Americans have experienced anything near the racism that black people have in the United States. I don't think they should even be inclu…

> It's ridiculous to say that Asian Americans have experienced anything near the racism that black people have in the United States. I don't think they should even be included in the conversion when talking about racism. The racism they experience is mostly prejudice-type racism, not systemic.

How much more systemic can you get than an Executive Order? Sure, it wasn't to the same degree as for black people, but shouldn't it have an effect? At least a little?

> If it's so easy for black people to get out of the cycle, why don't they?

Yeah, why don't they? Check the biography of every black celebrity. Everyone chose to get their shit together early in their life or was supported by the parents. EVERYONE! ICE T by joining the military to support his daughter. Samuel L. Jackson was sent to LA by his mother before anything bad could happen after a tip from the FBI.

At some point personal responsibility has to come into play.

Re: ‘Culture wars’ are fought by tiny minority – UK study

#362

Post by da39a3ee »

monoideism wrote: post #265

This is not my experience in the US. Culture wars have invaded both work and family life. It's not a tiny minority, it's many, if not most, Americans. I feel sure most Americans have the same experience, but perhaps I'm an outlier?

Yes, as someone with university-educated friends and families in large cities, the recent surge of intolerance of more centrist views on the identity-politics left are tearing apart both my friend and family groups.

Re: ‘Culture wars’ are fought by tiny minority – UK study

#363

Post by rmrfstar »

11thEarlOfMar wrote: post #289
another-dave wrote: post #56

I think the main culprit exacerbating this is the main stream media. "Vox pops" have formed part of filling air-time or column inches for a long while, but this is largely replaced now by journalists looking at Twitter and either a) using that as a stand-in for 'this is what the public think' or b) making it the story itself. Social media is no longer just "second screen" below-the-line commenting on events, it's hel…

In the US, it seems these 13% receive outsize political attention as well. I recall at the run up to the 2016 election, one of the main issues was gender and public bathroom usage. I couldn't help wondering at the time why that issue received so much attention vs. the 42,000 opioid overdose fatalities that year alone, which got virtually zero attention.

If you started talking about deaths of despair, you'd have to start talking about de-industrialization and how the Fed lied about it to give Congress political cover [1]. Can't go there.

[1] https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2018-03-12/shares...

Re: ‘Culture wars’ are fought by tiny minority – UK study

#364

Post by Nasrudith »

throwawaygh wrote: post #228
Miner49er wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well that's the thing. These diversity training people do use a different definition of racism then what you are thinking of. The diversity training definition of racism doesn't simply mean prejudiced, it means a part of a system of power that benefits people considered "white" at the expense of others. By that definition, most white people are probably "racist". If you understand the context used when they call them…

> it means a part of a system of power that benefits people considered "white" at the expense of others. This definition doesn't even bother me on face. Obviously, systems can be designed to advantage one group and disadvantage another group. And, obviously, Jim Crow effects the distribution of family wealth to this day. What bothers me about BigCorp diversity training is something a quite different. Choose a random…

Focusing on things they can reasonably change is a legitimate approach. It would be defacto illegal for them to engage in racially discriminative stock sales. Asking their ownership to please give away their stocks to random minorities sounds like a fast way to get booted by the board for crashing the stock value by creating a needless controversy .

Only fanatics seriously consider large scale forced redistribution for good reason - the damage to property rights causes the market to come tumbling down as it undermines trustworthiness. Would you work for someone who just decides one day "You know what? You worked for us for a decade - we're going to need all of your remaining salary back."?

Re: ‘Culture wars’ are fought by tiny minority – UK study

#365

Post by [deleted] »

username90 wrote: post #134
zozbot234 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any real proof that these diversity sessions actually help people work in diverse environments? The way you describe this, it reads like a really, really weird cargo cult where just confessing to one's supposed racism will somehow make you more open to people of differing backgrounds. How exactly does this help?

No. But the goal isn't for it to work, the goal of the advocates is to bill a lot of money and the goal of the company is to virtue signal. https://hbr.org/2012/03/diversity-training-doesnt-work

[deleted]

Re: ‘Culture wars’ are fought by tiny minority – UK study

#366

Post by globular-toast »

shadowgovt wrote: post #283
globular-toast wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are just conformists. PG wrote an excellent piece about conformism here: http://paulgraham.com/conformism.html True progressives are out there fighting current battles. Corruption, bribery, current-day slavery etc. Conformists are out there marching about battles already won like gay rights, slavery in the United States etc.

Gay rights is hardly a settled issue. If it were, the GOP wouldn't have adopted reversal of the Obergefell v. Hodges precedent as a party platform plank in 2016. https://news.yahoo.com/richard-grenell-addresses-rnc-gop-220...

The US isn't the world.

Re: ‘Culture wars’ are fought by tiny minority – UK study

#367

Post by shadowgovt »

luckylion wrote: post #353
shadowgovt wrote: post #348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Conflating trainings derived from theory based on research and evidence with religion is also strange.

I think research & evidence is vague when you include gender & diversity studies in sciences. There's a lot that's barely above an essay, it'll stick for a few years and then get retracted (gender pay gap anyone?) The cultish behavior surrounding it ("I'm a sinner, even though I never know when I'm sinning, I'm worthless, oh please, Lord, forgive me, I submit myself before your will") makes it look like a replacement…

> "I'm a sinner, even though I never know when I'm sinning"

The entire point of the courses I've seen is to bring people awareness of unconscious bias and thereby help them transition from ignorant commission of error to awareness of the potential for such error. And unconscious bias doesn't make one "worthless," it's (as far as we can tell) pretty ordinary human behavior.

Re: ‘Culture wars’ are fought by tiny minority – UK study

#369

Post by shadowgovt »

globular-toast wrote: post #366
shadowgovt wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gay rights is hardly a settled issue. If it were, the GOP wouldn't have adopted reversal of the Obergefell v. Hodges precedent as a party platform plank in 2016. https://news.yahoo.com/richard-grenell-addresses-rnc-gop-220...

The US isn't the world.

Obviously, but calling gay rights a "battle already won" when the third largest country in the world by population still has one of its two major political parties fighting tooth-and-claw on the issue seems premature.

Re: ‘Culture wars’ are fought by tiny minority – UK study

#370

Post by bobthepanda »

TheKarateKid wrote: post #352
andrew_ wrote: post #337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The Social Dilemma" on Netflix touches on this - in part, the algorithms that run these platforms and govern (guide?) user interaction are responsible in large part for pitting people against each other. It's in their best interest to keep eyeballs on their respective sites as much has humanly possible.

Yes algorithms contribute, but the media is the reason these problems go from being just an argument on social media, to an actual societal issue. Before the media started using social media as “facts” for their reporting, these arguments would just be another online “flame war.” Remember when we used those terms? Remember when online arguments remained as just that? Now, when 1000 people on Twitter try to cancel som…

There are legitimately things on social media that become much bigger and become a story in and of itself though. Breonna Taylor's case was not covered in MSM initially, and the continued pressure on it is largely due to social media self-sustaining it.
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