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Apple Q&A on gathering and use of location data (Apple Press Release)

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Re: Apple Q&A on gathering and use of location data (Apple Press Release)

#81

Post by jsz0 »

cooldeal wrote: post #47
sklivvz1971 wrote: post #3

3. Why is my iPhone logging my location? The iPhone is not logging your location. Rather, it’s maintaining a database of Wi-Fi hotspots and cell towers around your current location, some of which may be located more than one hundred miles away from your iPhone, to help your iPhone rapidly and accurately calculate its location when requested This actually makes sense - looking at the logs on my iPhone and iPad, the lo…

>and actually there was a very great deal of places where I've never been, not even close. How does that make sense? It should only cache the locations of cell phone towers it was in the range of. Are you seeing data that was more than 100 miles away from the places you were at?

Is it possible the cell tower you're locally connected to is aware of its adjacent towers and communicates this information back to the iPhone? If you're traveling at highway speeds, or perhaps on rail, a 100 mile radius won't cover a huge area. Looking at my own data it seemed to be closer to 200-300 miles in some cases. (in rural areas where presumably towers are spaced out further apart)

Re: Apple Q&A on gathering and use of location data (Apple Press Release)

#82

Post by DanielBMarkham »

The iPhone is not logging your location. Rather, it’s maintaining a database of Wi-Fi hotspots and cell towers around your current location, some of which may be located more than one hundred miles away from your iPhone, to help your iPhone rapidly and accurately calculate its location when requested

Can Apple locate me based on my geo-tagged Wi-Fi hotspot and cell tower data? No. This data is sent to Apple in an anonymous and encrypted form. Apple cannot identify the source of this data.

I think a lot of folks who spent money on Apple products are going to be happy with this, and for that I'm glad.

But I didn't find this release adequate. Apple is not tracking me -- they are keeping a time-stamped list of nearby access points on my device, which effectively is a huge breadcrumb trail of everywhere I've been and when. Apple doesn't know it's me -- because the data is encrypted, which makes no sense at all. Whether data is encrypted or not is meaningless. Can I go to the Apple server logs and track incoming downloads and associate them with the data or not? I strongly suspect the answer is "yes". If not, that's great, but that wasn't described here.

The killer omission? That Apple has been doing all of this -- which is at the very least controversial -- without informing the users in a manner in which they clearly understood it. The response we see is simply a reaction. The "bug" here is getting caught.

I don't necessarily see anything nefarious at work, but I'm troubled with the idea that Apple was keeping a list of my whereabouts (the nearest access point, for those of you who are literally-minded) without my knowing it. That's a pretty serious breach of user trust, no matter how many times it was covered in the 47-page lawyered-up doc that nobody reads.

But like I said, folks are willing to cut Apple lots of slack, and they deserve it. But hell if I'd want to see something like this happen again, from any manufacturer. I'm not so sure that vendors are getting the point.

Re: Apple Q&A on gathering and use of location data (Apple Press Release)

#84

Post by smackfu »

yalogin wrote: post #9

This is a perfectly reasonable explanation. I have seen this more and more lately, the standard reaction to anything Apple in the tech community is pitchforks. I have a feeling subconsciously we all want Apple to fail at something and try to latch on to anything remotely blamable.

Amazing how slow Apple's communications are though, in this modern age.

Re: Apple Q&A on gathering and use of location data (Apple Press Release)

#85

Post by MatthewPhillips »

Anechoic wrote: post #79
MatthewPhillips wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the reaction was appropriate. It confirms the major points that people were upset about: 1) that the data is stored unencrypted, 2) that it lives even after you turn off location services, 3) that it was taken without explicit permission. This press release doesn't change any of those points, it merely places the blame on bugs (which wouldn't have been patched had the story not been uncovered). Isn't this com…

which wouldn't have been patched had the story not been uncovered That's a pretty cynical reaction. Why would you make that assumption? Do you think that if someone had alerted Apple privately to the bug they never would have gotten around to fixing it?

I think there wouldn't be the same sense of urgency. I don't think that's cynical at all; that's the way business works. I've never worked at a company that doesn't push something when enough customers make a fuss about it.

Re: Apple Q&A on gathering and use of location data (Apple Press Release)

#86

Post by smackfu »

Anechoic wrote: post #79
MatthewPhillips wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the reaction was appropriate. It confirms the major points that people were upset about: 1) that the data is stored unencrypted, 2) that it lives even after you turn off location services, 3) that it was taken without explicit permission. This press release doesn't change any of those points, it merely places the blame on bugs (which wouldn't have been patched had the story not been uncovered). Isn't this com…

which wouldn't have been patched had the story not been uncovered That's a pretty cynical reaction. Why would you make that assumption? Do you think that if someone had alerted Apple privately to the bug they never would have gotten around to fixing it?

Because apparently this cache was well known already to researchers, and it was just the user-friendly interface that blew it up in the press.

Re: Apple Q&A on gathering and use of location data (Apple Press Release)

#87

Post by ugh »

DanielBMarkham wrote: post #82

The iPhone is not logging your location. Rather, it’s maintaining a database of Wi-Fi hotspots and cell towers around your current location, some of which may be located more than one hundred miles away from your iPhone, to help your iPhone rapidly and accurately calculate its location when requested Can Apple locate me based on my geo-tagged Wi-Fi hotspot and cell tower data? No. This data is sent to Apple in an ano…

It says "anonymous". The answer is yes. If it is possible Apple was lying.

Re: Apple Q&A on gathering and use of location data (Apple Press Release)

#88

Post by ugh »

mcantelon wrote: post #72
extension wrote: post #23

Ironically, shrinking the geolocation cache will result in more frequent requests to the server, making it theoretically easier for Apple to track your location.

GPS doesn't require requests to a server, AFAIK.

More frequent requests to get nearby WLAN access points and cell towers.

Re: Apple Q&A on gathering and use of location data (Apple Press Release)

#89

Post by [deleted] »

DanielBMarkham wrote: post #82

The iPhone is not logging your location. Rather, it’s maintaining a database of Wi-Fi hotspots and cell towers around your current location, some of which may be located more than one hundred miles away from your iPhone, to help your iPhone rapidly and accurately calculate its location when requested Can Apple locate me based on my geo-tagged Wi-Fi hotspot and cell tower data? No. This data is sent to Apple in an ano…

[deleted]
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