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An open letter to India’s youth: Get off that smartphone. It can destroy you

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

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Re: An open letter to India’s youth: Get off that smartphone. It can destroy you

#121

Post by coldtea »

UncleMeat wrote: post #117
coldtea wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Considered the opportunity cost? Or would any annoyance justify any solution, whatever the downsides?

What opportunity cost? Why is it impossible for me to conclude that possessing a smartphone does not cause me any harm? There is a persistent rhetoric among online technologists that people are wrong for making different value judgements. Some people don't like that their phone stores a record of their movements. That's fine. But people who disagree can do so for reasons other than ignorance.

>But people who disagree can do so for reasons other than ignorance.

Yes, and here's the key: they might still be wrong.

I'm not saying this is the case. I'm saying that this is a possibility. "I took an informed decision which is not due to ignorance" doesn't mean the decision can't still be wrong.

Not to mention that most people just adopt shiny new stuff, hardly pausing to indeed make informed decisions...

Re: An open letter to India’s youth: Get off that smartphone. It can destroy you

#122

Post by will4274 »

xnyan wrote: post #108

This not only came off as condescending, but also desperate and whiny. The first paragraph (paraphrased) “I am writing in a BIG newspaper, and I was taught that when someone writes in A Real Serious Newspaper, I deserve to be read” I look at newspapers like churches. Churches and newspapers are businesses in some ways, they exist because they meet the needs of their customers. I went to church as a little kid but I d…

> I don’t need old white dudes yelling at me that I am living my life “wrong”

I don't think the author of this article is white. Does that make you more receptive to his argument that folks who use their cell phones are living their lives "wrong"?

That's all to say - how are old white dudes relevant to this thread?

Re: An open letter to India’s youth: Get off that smartphone. It can destroy you

#123

Post by ulisesrmzroche »

altitudinous wrote: post #70
hnarn wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This whole idea that being without a phone is somehow liberating — and just not using it is definitely not as pure and wholly amazing as being completely without it — is to me a silly and predictable response to the very real drawbacks of high tech modern life. Phones have value. That’s why people use them. Pretending they don’t and that we’re all brainwashed doesn’t change that reality. Here’s an example: I want to…

You don't need a phone for any of the activities you described. Stores are pretty much open business hours, or 24 hours, they follow the same pattern. Or just show up and it is closed. Go somewhere else. Public transport runs to a schedule. Just show up and transport will show up within n minutes anyway, whether you know the time or nor. Or just use the timetable at the station. Yes, no music, just your thoughts. but…

There’s nothing liberating about any of that. It’s just a list of things you like to do.

Re: An open letter to India’s youth: Get off that smartphone. It can destroy you

#124

Post by talentedcoin »

altitudinous wrote: post #77
talentedcoin wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is like saying leaving home without your wallet is liberating. It’s true in a sense, but it’s also damned inconvenient depending on what you want to do. Then again, if you truly feel anxious without your phone all the time, maybe it’s worth a shot ...

Well, clearly not having money is not comparable to not having a phone. But you are just proving the OP original article. Why not just try something different rather than pointlessly arguing about the intricacies of it all on the internet

It’s nothing personal. I’m just always disappointed how much purchase these knee-jerk, unthoughtful, anti-tech reactions have on sites full of clever folks such as HN.

Re: An open letter to India’s youth: Get off that smartphone. It can destroy you

#125

Post by copperx »

eMSF wrote: post #95
hnarn wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This whole idea that being without a phone is somehow liberating — and just not using it is definitely not as pure and wholly amazing as being completely without it — is to me a silly and predictable response to the very real drawbacks of high tech modern life. Phones have value. That’s why people use them. Pretending they don’t and that we’re all brainwashed doesn’t change that reality. Here’s an example: I want to…

Why would you walk out the door before checking that the store is open, if the whole point of the excursion is to visit the store (and in this case, you don't have an idea when it is open)?

Because there's value in just making the trip if you're stopping to smell the flowers.

Re: An open letter to India’s youth: Get off that smartphone. It can destroy you

#126

Post by stevekemp »

UncleMeat wrote: post #71
coldtea wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Phones have value. That’s why people use them Now try the same line but with heroin, or fast food, or whatever people use to their detriment... Besides, anything that has value also has an opportunity cost, which can be much more important than the value inherent in the thing... > Here’s an example: I want to take public transport to a grocery store. I walk out the door. I don’t have my phone. First of all, if I do…

You’ve never got to a store only to realize they are closed on Mondays or something?

I left the house today, the store I intended to go to was closed. I went to another one.

Honestly if I'm with my child I frequently leave my phone at home. We can both concentrate on each other that way, and there's rarely anything more important than that. My wife has sometimes suggested I should take a phone with me one particular day, in case she wants to change (working) plans at the last minute, but otherwise we're happy without.

Re: An open letter to India’s youth: Get off that smartphone. It can destroy you

#127

Post by copperx »

talentedcoin wrote: post #124
altitudinous wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, clearly not having money is not comparable to not having a phone. But you are just proving the OP original article. Why not just try something different rather than pointlessly arguing about the intricacies of it all on the internet

It’s nothing personal. I’m just always disappointed how much purchase these knee-jerk, unthoughtful, anti-tech reactions have on sites full of clever folks such as HN.

Some of us hate the stuff that our industry produces. The sentiment isn't uncommon in other industries either.

Re: An open letter to India’s youth: Get off that smartphone. It can destroy you

#128

Post by tzs »

oakpond wrote: post #56
skrebbel wrote: post #14

I think this is a good message, but by making the phone the problem I fear the author misses a fundamental connection to the youth he addresses. The issue is what you do on a phone, not the phone itself. In fact, phones make it a lot easier to create and not just consume, than televisions did back in the author's youth. And I bet there were similar anti-TV op-eds in newspapers in those days that the author would have…

Create what exactly? I'm under the impression that you can hardly create anything on a phone except for cat movies and shopping lists.

Get some talented people together, and you can do some pretty good looking movies. E.g., "Snowbrawl" [1]. Here's a "making of" for that [2] showing the equipment used.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cM8DcCoZulw

[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAJwbyu-2mE

Re: An open letter to India’s youth: Get off that smartphone. It can destroy you

#129

Post by UncleMeat »

coldtea wrote: post #121
UncleMeat wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What opportunity cost? Why is it impossible for me to conclude that possessing a smartphone does not cause me any harm? There is a persistent rhetoric among online technologists that people are wrong for making different value judgements. Some people don't like that their phone stores a record of their movements. That's fine. But people who disagree can do so for reasons other than ignorance.

> But people who disagree can do so for reasons other than ignorance. Yes, and here's the key: they might still be wrong. I'm not saying this is the case. I'm saying that this is a possibility. "I took an informed decision which is not due to ignorance" doesn't mean the decision can't still be wrong. Not to mention that most people just adopt shiny new stuff, hardly pausing to indeed make informed decisions...

> Yes, and here's the key: they might still be wrong.

I truly do not believe I am wrong for having a smartphone in my pocket when going to the store. I understand the structure and behavior of mobile apps and mobile operating systems far better than most.

> Not to mention that most people just adopt shiny new stuff, hardly pausing to indeed make informed decisions...

Now we are back at the ignorance claim! I've got a PhD in mobile security. I've been working in this space for more than a decade! I assure you I have done more than "hardly pausing".

People claimed that bicycles would cause the destruction of society when they were introduced. Can't I just declare that all of the skeptics are ignorant luddites using the same arguments you are?

Re: An open letter to India’s youth: Get off that smartphone. It can destroy you

#130

Post by 10000truths »

oakpond wrote: post #84
st1x7 wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're already looking too deeply into this. Just create, call yourself a creator and call your output content. Don't think about it too much.

Got it, I'm a creator of comment-section content.

You joke, but there's an actual market for that on Reddit.
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