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When You Get into Unschooling, It’s Almost Like a Religion

nytimes.com

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Re: When You Get into Unschooling, It’s Almost Like a Religion

#11

Post by xtagon »

hereme888 wrote: post #8
t0mbstone wrote: post #7

I was homeschooled until the age of around 10, and then my family adopted a new approach called "lifestyle of learning", which is just another way of saying "unschooling". Basically, I was allowed to skip schoolwork, as long as I was doing something productive. I hated schoolwork, so I started spending all my spare time tinkering with stuff on the computer. I wasn't allowed to play video games (since they aren't prod…

That's impressive, and sounds like what I was thinking for my future children. I just have no idea where to start. Got any resources for me to learn how to do these things for my children?

My story is similar to that of the parent comment and I would say the most important thing is to be supportive of the activities and interests that your future children are driven towards. If they're into computers, let them tinker with computers. If they like to take things apart, give them your old electrical components and teach them about electrical safety and soldering. If they like making things, show them some cool DIY videos on YouTube. Whatever it is, if they're into it and you support them, then all that time spent is practice doing something they love, regardless of whether or not it ends up being a career.

Re: When You Get into Unschooling, It’s Almost Like a Religion

#13

Post by joncp »

t0mbstone wrote: post #7

I was homeschooled until the age of around 10, and then my family adopted a new approach called "lifestyle of learning", which is just another way of saying "unschooling". Basically, I was allowed to skip schoolwork, as long as I was doing something productive. I hated schoolwork, so I started spending all my spare time tinkering with stuff on the computer. I wasn't allowed to play video games (since they aren't prod…

It sounds like you and your brother are highly intelligent and maybe didn't really need school to absorb the stuff you needed. I wonder how that approach would work with a more average child.

Re: When You Get into Unschooling, It’s Almost Like a Religion

#14

Post by throwawaygh »

Goronmon wrote: post #10
t0mbstone wrote: post #7

I was homeschooled until the age of around 10, and then my family adopted a new approach called "lifestyle of learning", which is just another way of saying "unschooling". Basically, I was allowed to skip schoolwork, as long as I was doing something productive. I hated schoolwork, so I started spending all my spare time tinkering with stuff on the computer. I wasn't allowed to play video games (since they aren't prod…

What about careers other than software development though? I'm definitely not criticizing your choices at all, but its interesting to me that both your brother and yourself ended up doing software development. Do you feel you would have a different option of "unschooling" if you had tried to be successful in a different career path?

Or even software in the next few years/decades when regulations catch up and having a 16 year old do contract work becomes too large a liability.

Re: When You Get into Unschooling, It’s Almost Like a Religion

#15

Post by ksdale »

mathnovice wrote: post #5

Learning of (keyword of) concepts and ideas is fun but the reason schools exist is because most learning is a grind. Learning to draw well, learning a language, learning an instrument, and even learning math and logic require going through the grind of learning and repetition. The grind is only harder if you don't have a good book or teacher because the practice you do could potentially be actively harmful (or useles…

I think the question is how much of the grind is necessary. When our oldest kids were very little, we would work on the alphabet and numbers and track milestones carefully. At some point we realized that we could either grind hard at stuff they just didn't quite get, or we could wait a few months until they were older and just tell them stuff and they'd remember it. And obviously it wasn't quite that easy, but it felt kind of like magic at the time. When the kids were ready to learn, they just did, no grinding required.

Naturally, something like playing a musical instrument requires grinding (though it's not grinding if you like it!). But I think other than like, the times tables or the periodic table, there's almost nothing in school that inherently requires a grind. It just feels like a grind, because school is often unpleasant.

I think an average, literate adult could learn basically the entire American K-12 history curriculum in a few months of reading. Most of what passes for history in elementary school could be compressed into... what, a hundred pages, maybe? And high school is another thousand pages.

I think math is the same way. It's a 10 year grind to teach reluctant kids what could be taught to an eager adult in a few months.

I think we'd do much better to try to create eager adults, which I think unschooling is really well-suited to.

Re: When You Get into Unschooling, It’s Almost Like a Religion

#16

Post by unnouinceput »

Kednicma wrote: post #2

I wonder whether maths really can be self-taught for more than about two generations. It has been known since the beginning of maths that it must be taught by teachers who understand the ideas to students who challenge the descriptions.

Yes, Math can be self-taught. I am a living example. I went through school, up to 10th grade (junior high school) with only getting minimum passing grades. I was worse at everything except History. That was the only thing that I liked. And even at History I was getting like medium grades, not the highest marks.

Then in the summer vacation between 10th grade and 11th grade I got hit with a hobby of Electronics. I read by mistake an old book, from 60's, that was in my father's book collection, of how to create a radio for short waves that was powered by a potato (the vegetable, not the sarcasm!). And I went down through that rabbit hole. I started to learn electronic components and what they do. That required Physics, which I knew nothing about it - so I started to learn Physics as well. Well, have you ever encountered Physics to be, in practice, applicable without Math? So I started to learn Math all by myself. Between ages of 16 to 18, while I was as Senior in high school I recovered all previous 10 years when I slacked worse than a worm. That allowed me to go to University where I got hit by another hobby - programming. Both these hobbies still stay with me to this day.

So yeah, I would argue not only is possible to learn Math all by yourself, but I'd say that doing so you actually learn it even better then when is forced upon you, even if you're good at it.

Re: When You Get into Unschooling, It’s Almost Like a Religion

#17

Post by nemo1618 »

bigbubba wrote: post #9
mathnovice wrote: post #5

Learning of (keyword of) concepts and ideas is fun but the reason schools exist is because most learning is a grind. Learning to draw well, learning a language, learning an instrument, and even learning math and logic require going through the grind of learning and repetition. The grind is only harder if you don't have a good book or teacher because the practice you do could potentially be actively harmful (or useles…

It's only a 'grind' if you don't enjoy the process though, right? If you're getting good at doing something you love because you love doing it so much, I don't think 'grind' is a word you'd use to describe that time consuming process. I think 'grind' is caused by a disconnect between what the learner is being made to do and what they want to do. Grind can therefore be reduced by providing people with the opportunity…

This is true on its face for anyone who's spent hours and hours trying to beat a tough level of a video game -- we even call it "grinding" (at least in some contexts, namely RPGs), and to some extent it's not really "fun," but it also has a satisfying and compulsive aspect that drives you onward despite the challenge. I can't recall public education ever stirring the same sort of feeling in me (and I did quite well in school).

Re: When You Get into Unschooling, It’s Almost Like a Religion

#18

Post by hereme888 »

xtagon wrote: post #11
hereme888 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's impressive, and sounds like what I was thinking for my future children. I just have no idea where to start. Got any resources for me to learn how to do these things for my children?

My story is similar to that of the parent comment and I would say the most important thing is to be supportive of the activities and interests that your future children are driven towards. If they're into computers, let them tinker with computers. If they like to take things apart, give them your old electrical components and teach them about electrical safety and soldering. If they like making things, show them some…

Thanks. May I ask what its like for job interviews?

Re: When You Get into Unschooling, It’s Almost Like a Religion

#19

Post by Proziam »

I attended brick and mortar schools until 8th grade and then basically did zero actual school work because I was too busy starting my own business among other activities I found interesting. I eventually crammed for about 2 weeks to get my high school diploma at my mother's request, then I moved to Sweden for a while (on my own, as a teenager).

My school experience was abysmal and doing things my own way allowed me to actually learn stuff that would end up being useful. I'd not have made it half as far if I had gone the traditional route.

Currently 28 and satisfied with how things have played out so far.

Re: When You Get into Unschooling, It’s Almost Like a Religion

#20

Post by ramraj07 »

joncp wrote: post #13
t0mbstone wrote: post #7

I was homeschooled until the age of around 10, and then my family adopted a new approach called "lifestyle of learning", which is just another way of saying "unschooling". Basically, I was allowed to skip schoolwork, as long as I was doing something productive. I hated schoolwork, so I started spending all my spare time tinkering with stuff on the computer. I wasn't allowed to play video games (since they aren't prod…

It sounds like you and your brother are highly intelligent and maybe didn't really need school to absorb the stuff you needed. I wonder how that approach would work with a more average child.

Intelligence is not hereditary for the most part, and there's a huge environmental component to it. Clearly this household had the right mix of freedom and strictness to encourage development of creative intelligent thinking. Probably rubs off of adults with same attitudes. Of course it's not 100% I'm pretty sure if OP had more siblings one of them would be bound to be dumb as a rock.
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