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Dropbox Attempts To Kill Open Source Project

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Re: Dropbox Attempts To Kill Open Source Project

#71

Post by billymeltdown »

arashf wrote: post #21

This is Arash from Dropbox. We removed the ability to share the project source code because it enables communications with our servers in a manner that is a violation of our Terms of Service. By our TOS, we reserve the right to terminate the account of users in this case. However, we chose to remove access to the file instead of terminating the account of the user. We recently built a tool that allows us to ban links…

If I may ask something quite specific: how do you justify _automated_ transmission of DMCA take-down requests? Shouldn't a human being be reviewing them first to prevent this sort of thing? Do you guys care? I mean, who's idea was that? As a customer and a developer, I'd really like to know.

Re: Dropbox Attempts To Kill Open Source Project

#72

Post by joe_the_user »

tptacek wrote: post #41

Consider that maybe what's happening here is boring. Recognize that we all have a cognitive bias towards narratives, and especially interesting narratives. The discussion on this story is trying to build a narrative about Dropbox vs. open source developers. The real story is probably not that interesting. The CTO of a service as technically interesting as Dropbox certainly knows that he can't prevent the disclosure o…

"Thus far, the only thing Dropbox is purported to have done here is to politely ask a developer to remove an application; then, presumably believing that the mirror posts were simple nerd-rage, and that the author of the application agreed with Dropbox, Dropbox's CTO filed takedowns at Github"

It's the "write a sentence long enough you hope they won't reach the end" rhetorical strategy!

Lawyer: "Your honor, the only thing my client is accused of is politely asking Mr. Jones to stop talking to his girlfriend ... and then punching Smith in the nose believing he had Jones' agreement"

I have to say "well-done" (did you study with Suruman at Orthanc by any chance?).

The web is presently full of entities making egregious claims to intellectual property rights over anything and everything they happen to have touched. You should know quite well that a fair amount of property rights come whether or not a person can effectively claim them and so dropbox's claim to "own" an algorithm can never be simply irrelevant or a "figleaf".

It may not make that much difference but I think it makes some difference to cast some sunlight onto these efforts. Boring or not.

Re: Dropbox Attempts To Kill Open Source Project

#73

Post by mnutt »

elliottcarlson wrote: post #31
arashf wrote: post #21

This is Arash from Dropbox. We removed the ability to share the project source code because it enables communications with our servers in a manner that is a violation of our Terms of Service. By our TOS, we reserve the right to terminate the account of users in this case. However, we chose to remove access to the file instead of terminating the account of the user. We recently built a tool that allows us to ban links…

"We have received a notification under the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (“DMCA”) from Dropbox that the following material is claimed to be infringing." Doesn't this seem to imply that Dropbox is the owner of the code and is both the DCMA submitter as well as the company executing upon it? An automated system would still require a company name that is requesting the DCMA to be entered, or your automated system is…

Sounds like the DMCA request was an accident. Maybe it's a form with a field "Company who requested file be removed: ".

But it's amusing nonetheless. Are there other incidents of a company serving itself DMCA requests?

Re: Dropbox Attempts To Kill Open Source Project

#74

Post by neworbit »

As much as I'd like to see companies busted for abusing the DMCA to take down things they object to, I would rather it had been one of the traditional Big Media Thugs who was on the wrong end of a lawsuit for fraudulent DMCA claims rather than Dropbox... who I otherwise like.

Re: Dropbox Attempts To Kill Open Source Project

#75

Post by dporan »

The journalist A.J. Liebling said, "Freedom of the press is guaranteed only to those who own one."

I guess the corollary here is, "If you don't own the server, you don't own the file."

Maybe this is why Richard Stallman calls cloud computing "careless computing."

Re: Dropbox Attempts To Kill Open Source Project

#76

Post by crocowhile »

power78 wrote: post #52
yid wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hi Arash, I find it hard to believe that you did not anticipate exactly this happening when designing (a) an online file backup service, (b) a "de"-duplication algorithm. That said, you should have planned for exactly this a long time ago, whether by the means DropShip used, or any of several other potential file sharing hacks. I think a lot of us here are disappointed with how your actions reflect that planning, or…

I agree. I actually proposed this idea a while back but never went through with the implementation. I hope Dropbox turns a blind eye to this because I think its fair use of Dropbox. Instead of someone sending you the file and then you adding it to Dropbox manually, you can just send the hash for the file and receive without P2P. This is where the world of online storage might head anyways.

Or you can just share a folder with someone or give them the public link - and both are even easier solutions.

Re: Dropbox Attempts To Kill Open Source Project

#77

Post by bitmage »

arashf wrote: post #21

This is Arash from Dropbox. We removed the ability to share the project source code because it enables communications with our servers in a manner that is a violation of our Terms of Service. By our TOS, we reserve the right to terminate the account of users in this case. However, we chose to remove access to the file instead of terminating the account of the user. We recently built a tool that allows us to ban links…

DMCA notices aren't a joke that you can idly send to anyone who annoys you. You are legally liable for them, and telling a judge "Oh, we just send them automatically without checking" is not going to help your case.

Re: Dropbox Attempts To Kill Open Source Project

#78

Post by rick888 »

mncolinlee wrote: post #57
ugh wrote: post #28

Understandable. Dropbox doesn't want to become a piracy website. Using a DMCA takedown request was a stupid way of dealing with the issue, though.

Why does everyone make the assumption that torrents and services like Dropship must be used for piracy? Major video game companies use torrents all the time to distribute patches and betas. A knife can be used to commit murder, but most often it is simply used to cut food. The problem with the way DMCA works is that it bars the development of new technologies because one of many uses could be harmful. The law stifles…

"A knife can be used to commit murder, but most often it is simply used to cut food."

Most of the time, a knife is used for cutting food and it can be used for murder.

Most of the time, torrents are used for piracy and they can be used for legitimate and legal files.

Search for "torrent" on Google. The majority of the results are search engines for pirated material (and in many cases, direct links to the torrents).

See the difference?

Re: Dropbox Attempts To Kill Open Source Project

#79

Post by gobongo »

arashf wrote: post #21

This is Arash from Dropbox. We removed the ability to share the project source code because it enables communications with our servers in a manner that is a violation of our Terms of Service. By our TOS, we reserve the right to terminate the account of users in this case. However, we chose to remove access to the file instead of terminating the account of the user. We recently built a tool that allows us to ban links…

It is a shame your developers allowed you to commit perjury in such an automated fashion.

With all due respect to you and your company (and while I fully support your right to invoke your TOS to take down content within your own service) I'd actually love to see one of the people you DMCA'd slam you on that aspect of this situation legally if for no other reason than to make other companies think twice (or three times) before they improperly invoke the DMCA to scare people into submission.

Re: Dropbox Attempts To Kill Open Source Project

#80

Post by mtogo »

runjake wrote: post #59
amock wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you need Dropbox or just something like it? Dropbox doesn't seem to have very strong network effects so it seems like it would be easy to replace with a similar product. If you're willing to give up features that require hashes to be shared across accounts you could even have a secure replacement with client side encryption.

Your comment would've been much more helpful had you provided said alternatives.

Four seconds on duckduckgo: https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/List_of_onlin...
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