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On William Deresiewicz’s “The Death of the Artist”

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Re: On William Deresiewicz’s “The Death of the Artist”

#21
Deresiewicz's story is inconsistent.

First, he writes that early artists (Da Vinci, Bach etc.) basically saw themselves as artisans who worked jobs for their patrons, who essentially sheltered them from the cold realities of the market.

Later, he laments that now artists are crushed by the market and can't have any stability that Bach et. al. enjoyed. He's missing a ton of contemporary working artists, who still have their patrons - visual artists working in game dev, musicians composing music for movies, commercials, video games etc. These people have steady income, just like Bach did. Of course, they're not really working on what they'd like to be working on, but neither really did Da Vinci (he was known to procrastinate a ton when asked to produce another boring portrait of somebody's daugther - a portrait which comically now could fetch tens of millions of dollars).

Re: On William Deresiewicz’s “The Death of the Artist”

#22
post #17
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it’s not just that there’s more art now, it’s also that the systems we use to consume it (spotify, Netflix, etc) shape that art, sometimes for the better but often for the worse. It’s like when the CEO of spotify said recently that “you can’t make an album every 3 years and be successful anymore.” He’s mostly right, but he skips over the part that he is probably the person most responsible for that fact. He a…

> cranking out 3x as much music is unlikely to result in higher quality art On the contrary, the more you produce, the more outstanding your hits. Yes there's more crap too, but nobody sees the crap. They only see the good stuff (thanks to recommendation algorithms, charts, and marketing). Here's the usual pottery class story that people use to talk about this phenomena: > The ceramics teacher announced on opening da…

Run a second-rate band through strip clubs for 8hrs a day for months and you won't get the Beatles. You washed quality out of the conversation by only looking at the stats.

Roald Dahl stepped out of a fighter plane in ww2 and into a writing role. His first stories were wartime stories, which has a quality you can't grind out. He has since proved himself to be a good writer.

Someone in your pottery class mistook perfectionism for quality.

There are a few french chefs that run perfectionism as a culture, with the corollary that if you think you achieved it, you haven't and you should start again. It works in a time-limited task like making food for hungry customers.

It doesn't work when you allow people to ponder what it means to be perfect forever. The important qualities in life have a meaning and aren't just points on a scale to perfection which you have to grind out.

Re: On William Deresiewicz’s “The Death of the Artist”

#23

Deresiewicz's story is inconsistent. First, he writes that early artists (Da Vinci, Bach etc.) basically saw themselves as artisans who worked jobs for their patrons, who essentially sheltered them from the cold realities of the market. Later, he laments that now artists are crushed by the market and can't have any stability that Bach et. al. enjoyed. He's missing a ton of contemporary working artists, who still have…

I remember seeing sketches of catapults and military inventions, which Leonardo da Vinci put together as marketing material and a sales pitch (I believe to the lord of Milan). Like, "I can create all sorts of machines both for the protection of a city and for siege." It struck me how being an entrepreneur - learning to swim in the realities of the market - was (and is) an essential part of being an artist.

Re: On William Deresiewicz’s “The Death of the Artist”

#24

Yeah, it's harder to be an artist because the internet has connected the whole world. The world used to be less connected and as a result, had lots of inefficient redundancy. If you wanted to see a play before, your options are pretty limited. Now, you can watch the best cast in the world from 10 years ago. It's only bad to be an artist now because art has become competitive. This is awful for the artists, but awesom…

>This is awful for the artists, but awesome for everyone who enjoys art.

I'm not so sure about the last part. Because in the meantime, theater has become "televised performance", concern has become "album or stream", etc.

So they get a better performance but not exactly the same thing as before...

And lots of the magic is in the moment and the interaction with the live audience and in the volatility of the experience...

I think that the end result is not that it's "awesome for everyone who enjoys art" but that people consume art more conveniently and disposably, and (most of it) enjoy it less.

Re: On William Deresiewicz’s “The Death of the Artist”

#25
post #24

Yeah, it's harder to be an artist because the internet has connected the whole world. The world used to be less connected and as a result, had lots of inefficient redundancy. If you wanted to see a play before, your options are pretty limited. Now, you can watch the best cast in the world from 10 years ago. It's only bad to be an artist now because art has become competitive. This is awful for the artists, but awesom…

> This is awful for the artists, but awesome for everyone who enjoys art. I'm not so sure about the last part. Because in the meantime, theater has become "televised performance", concern has become "album or stream", etc. So they get a better performance but not exactly the same thing as before... And lots of the magic is in the moment and the interaction with the live audience and in the volatility of the experienc…

Actually, it's the opposite. At least for music. Because streaming revenue is so much lower than producing a CD or record, artists are increasingly focusing on live performances (1). While music sales free fall, live music revenues continue to grow at a fast rate. There are also semi-live music experiences where small streamers interact with their audience in real time over twitch.

No matter what type of music you enjoy, it has never been easier to consume it in an exploding variety of formats and levels of interaction. The level of access and variety is unparalleled.

(1) https://www.statista.com/statistics/1096409/live-music-indus....

Re: On William Deresiewicz’s “The Death of the Artist”

#26

Yeah, it's harder to be an artist because the internet has connected the whole world. The world used to be less connected and as a result, had lots of inefficient redundancy. If you wanted to see a play before, your options are pretty limited. Now, you can watch the best cast in the world from 10 years ago. It's only bad to be an artist now because art has become competitive. This is awful for the artists, but awesom…

> This is truly the peak of art. [1,2]? Hamilton? [1] https://www.forbes.com/sites/lisettevoytko/2020/09/18/provoc... [2] https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/modern-art-was-cia-...

It's easy enough to find silly examples from literally any period.

[1] https://www.pinterest.co.uk/senoritamadmax/ancient-art-fails...

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