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White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

theguardian.com

41–50 of 80 posts

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#41
post #26

This article is garbage. Nowhere in it does it substantiate the claim in the title. The best you get is this speculation from a "scientist" presenting no evidence: You probably want to have a period where the auditory system can wind down, regenerate and prepare for the next wake period. Nothing to see here.

The article does link to the review mentioned by the researcher : https://doi.org/10.1016/j.smrv.2020.101385

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#42

The article makes it sound like the alternative to white noise is luxurious, dead silence. But, especially in the city, the alternative is usually just patches of semi-silence interrupted by loud or sharp things. Dogs barking, a police siren, the neighbor coming home at 3am, your partner flushing the toilet, inexplicable noises that start and then stop before you realize why you're up. I listen to white noise like a…

I live in an apartment building in a quite noisy locale, Manhattan in New York City.

I solved the problem with pliable silicone "putty" earplugs. They provide the closest to dead silence I've found.

The earplugs attenuate sound by 50% is my guess, making inaudible all but the loudest ambulance sirens and shoes dropped to the floor in the unit above.

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#43

I find the best thing for falling asleep in a noisy room is noise-cancelling headphones. I get very annoyed by the sound of humming fans and the like, and can’t imagine why you’d want to add more noise! The only downside is that it’s hard to find noise cancelling headphones that are comfortable to wear while sleeping, if you sleep on your side. Big market opportunity here!

haven't tried 'sleep buds' in particular, but had tried a different product ($399!) and... the 'white noise' sound they had had some noticeable ... frequency that my brain locked in to. After about 3 days it was impossible to use them - my brain actively stayed awake with them in, trying to find the sounds it 'knew' were there. Switched to bose QC20 and... they're generally great ... except... don't sleep in them! Th…

I've had Sony WH-1000XM3's for the past year and I sleep with them all the time. I probably roll over and crush them pretty regularly, but they seem very robust. They're very comfortable to wear for long periods (if you don't roll over on to your side, that is). Excellent noise cancellation too.

I did have older/cheaper Sony ANC headphones previously which broke at the hinges, but these seem unbreakable (touch wood).

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#45
post #39

I was hoping to see something about how this affects babies in there ️

I used Meshuggah - Bleed and a carrying harness to get my then 2 month old to sleep. Close enough to white noise, and motivation for daddy to keep rocking. Not sure I want to read research on whether that was a good idea..

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#46
post #16

For those who don't find it compelling enough to get to the end: this extremely vague message brought to you by .

Based on that comment I was expecting to find an article that was either written by someone from an app company, or that heavily talked about a particular app and its benefits.

Nope. Here's what dingle3 is complaining about. After 8 paragraphs on white noise and its affects on sleep, the last scientist they quotes this in paragraph 8:

> Prof Christian Cajochen, who heads the Centre for Chronobiology at the University of Basel in Switzerland, said: “I think the better [forms of] continuous white noise mask highly intermittent background noise, which is why it is recommended for nightshift workers who often need to sleep during the day in a ‘noisy’ environment. There I can see a benefit, but not when sleeping in a relatively quiet environment. Any acoustic stimulus being continuous or not has the potential to interrupt the sleep process.”

they have one more paragraph, a single sentence long, where that scientist says that he'd rather recommend mindfulness apps that are based on good evidence from research, and names on particular app as an example.

> He added: “I would rather recommend mindfulness apps like Sleepio, since they are based on good evidence coming from research in sleep medicine, particularly cognitive behavioural therapy for insomnia.”

That's the entire mention of mindfulness apps in the article.

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#47
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not that hard to find: https://www.bose.com/en_us/products/wellness/noise_masking_s... https://www.bose.com/en_us/better_with_bose/better-sleep-is-... https://www.trustedreviews.com/news/bose-sleepbuds-2-feature...

These are not (active) noise cancelling!

Agree not ‘active’ but they are though, as in, cancelling it from your perception. Bose does a lot with the perceptual aspect of audio, which makes me dislike their speakers (the sound is too thin, not moving enough air) but impressed with their noise cancelling until Sony got serious recently.

Sort of into the noise cancelling thing, and a side sleeper, so I agree with you there’s not a great set of options.

I own last 3 generations of Sony full size noise cancelling head phones, Sony’s latest wireless noise cancelling, Apple’s AirPods Pro, two prior generations of Bose QuietComfort, and last two generations each of the in-ear wired noise cancelling earbuds from Bose and Sony. I go try out new models from other manufacturers, and am not finding anything compelling outside of the two well known brands and the AirPods Pro.

The only ones among all these I’ve found useful for sleeping in a bed are the Bose Sleepbuds (v1, I don’t have v2). For the sleepbuds, the reviews go into sleepability:

https://newatlas.com/wearables/bose-sleepbuds-ii/

That said, the most effective I’ve found for sleeping on a plane are the semi-wireless behind neck / in ear headphones from Sony (prior WI1000X/N seem better than newer WI1000XM2 when playing music or white noise) using their foam gel ear inserts. (In fact, for using any of the earbud models on planes, if they don’t have it already, I do replace rubber ear inserts with memory foam type ear inserts.)

But none of the active models work for me for bed because I’m a side sleeper and even then, all night battery without wires is another deal breaker.

Only the Bose Sleepbuds were all-night comfortable, but careful selection from among available sounds turned out to shut out the world to a degree that I stopped using them on travel out of concern I might not hear something that should wake me. In other words, the sound perception dampening was too good.

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#48
post #46
post #16

For those who don't find it compelling enough to get to the end: this extremely vague message brought to you by .

Based on that comment I was expecting to find an article that was either written by someone from an app company, or that heavily talked about a particular app and its benefits. Nope. Here's what dingle3 is complaining about. After 8 paragraphs on white noise and its affects on sleep, the last scientist they quotes this in paragraph 8: > Prof Christian Cajochen, who heads the Centre for Chronobiology at the University…

the entire things reads like someone trying to push an alternative. there is no evidence in one direction or the other, and nothing is really being said with any conviction.

native advertising is real, and subtlety is key sometimes. if this was not sponsored by the app mentioned in the last paragraph, i'd be very surprised.

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#49
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TIL! My jaw is almost never relaxed, and I clench my teeth together when I sleep. Interesting correlation.

Oh. Take it from me, go see a dentist, and ask them to look for cracks in your teeth, and receding gums. If they do a panorex x ray they can also look for bone growth in your jaw. I clench, didn’t know about it for years and so didn’t have a mouth guard. Have a bunch of cracks in my molars now. My dentist always used to say these sort of cracks were the biggest problem in adult dentistry. The solution is to get a mou…

Thanks for the advice! I'll ask about this at my next appointment.

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#50

The article makes it sound like the alternative to white noise is luxurious, dead silence. But, especially in the city, the alternative is usually just patches of semi-silence interrupted by loud or sharp things. Dogs barking, a police siren, the neighbor coming home at 3am, your partner flushing the toilet, inexplicable noises that start and then stop before you realize why you're up. I listen to white noise like a…

I live in an apartment building in a quite noisy locale, Manhattan in New York City. I solved the problem with pliable silicone "putty" earplugs. They provide the closest to dead silence I've found. The earplugs attenuate sound by 50% is my guess, making inaudible all but the loudest ambulance sirens and shoes dropped to the floor in the unit above.

I'm not sure where I heard it but I've heard that wearing earplugs for prolonged periods isn't good either. Beyond that, I don't like the feeling (even of the putty ones) after a few hours. My ears start to feel clammy and like I'm building some kind of bacteria dish inside my ear.

Ear plugs have never been enough for me. Also - if it gets too quiet then my tinnitus starts going. Thus, like OP, I use a fan. Bothers my partner but she's gotten used to it. She can't stand the part where I like having it pointed at me too (I'm not very good at regulating body temperature at night without one).

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