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A GeekDad’s 8-Year Old Daughter Reinvents Chess

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Re: A GeekDad’s 8-Year Old Daughter Reinvents Chess

#11

Post by TillE »

balakk wrote: post #8
Contractor69 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the point he's trying to make is that we're all so conditioned to accept institutions without question ("we do it that way because we've ALWAYS done it that way"). This is beaten into us (and creativity beaten OUT OF us) as children, especially through the public schools. Clearly it's not irreverent to innovate, but I can imagine the shock/horror of the mainstream at the "reinvention" of chess.

While the point is valid, certain institutions do require some reverence and respect. Chess is certainly such a game. I'm not saying one has to be a Fischer to invent a new chess format; but unless the person has seriously understood/appreciated the complexities of chess, I'll have trouble taking them seriously. Irreverence is good if it comes from deep understanding and knowledge or genius - otherwise it just comes…

That's only true if you're trying to invent something better, Chess 2.0. If you're just trying to create something different and fun with similar rules, it's not really necessary to deeply understand the strategic balance of chess.

Re: A GeekDad’s 8-Year Old Daughter Reinvents Chess

#12

Post by JoeAltmaier »

tokenadult wrote: post #10

Is it in any sense news that people have developed variant forms of chess? http://www.chessvariants.com/ http://mathworld.wolfram.com/FairyChess.html After all, isn't current Western chess itself a variant of the (possibly Indian) game from which it originated? http://www.tradgames.org.uk/games/Chess.htm http://history.chess.free.fr/history.htm If you know people from China, Taiwan, or Vietnam, you may have had the o…

...and so you post this, which is hypocritical on the face of it.

Since you seems to have missed the rules referenced in the article, here they are:

http://changizi.wordpress.com/2011/04/20/plastic-animal-ches...

Re: A GeekDad’s 8-Year Old Daughter Reinvents Chess

#13

Post by hsmyers »

The age of the daughter is not a surprise--- the number of children who learn chess and happen to be 8 is actually quite large(and no I don't have a citation, this is anecdotal). However of that group the number who the next day or so invent fairy-chess with a Fisher(kind of) variation is probably pretty close to 1! Were I the father, I'd be enormously proud and more than a little stunned. Shaking that off, I'd begin to encourage this spark as much as I could...

Re: A GeekDad’s 8-Year Old Daughter Reinvents Chess

#14

Post by scott_s »

tokenadult wrote: post #10

Is it in any sense news that people have developed variant forms of chess? http://www.chessvariants.com/ http://mathworld.wolfram.com/FairyChess.html After all, isn't current Western chess itself a variant of the (possibly Indian) game from which it originated? http://www.tradgames.org.uk/games/Chess.htm http://history.chess.free.fr/history.htm If you know people from China, Taiwan, or Vietnam, you may have had the o…

Not really. The author uses his daughter inventing a new game as a springboard to speculate on the relationship between irreverence and innovation. The title, unfortunately, is geared towards his hook, not his point.

Re: A GeekDad’s 8-Year Old Daughter Reinvents Chess

#15

Post by donofrip »

There has been some debate regarding PG's "naughtiness" criteria for founders. Maybe irreverence would be a better word? To truly believe in their venture, founders need to have a certain irreverence for how things are done today or how the world is missing out on their idea.

Re: A GeekDad’s 8-Year Old Daughter Reinvents Chess

#16

Post by pbhjpbhj »

TillE wrote: post #11
balakk wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While the point is valid, certain institutions do require some reverence and respect. Chess is certainly such a game. I'm not saying one has to be a Fischer to invent a new chess format; but unless the person has seriously understood/appreciated the complexities of chess, I'll have trouble taking them seriously. Irreverence is good if it comes from deep understanding and knowledge or genius - otherwise it just comes…

That's only true if you're trying to invent something better , Chess 2.0. If you're just trying to create something different and fun with similar rules, it's not really necessary to deeply understand the strategic balance of chess.

Exactly. She appeared to make something more complex (though I didn't look at the rules). But perhaps it's something that allows here to make stories about it better, or something that uses her favourite toys, or something that is more fun for some other reason.

Now, if she'd said - that game is no good, it's not complex enough, it's not challenging enough or somesuch (and wasn't a grandmaster) then I think she would perhaps have been irreverent, though more likely ignorant.

Re: A GeekDad’s 8-Year Old Daughter Reinvents Chess

#17

Post by hammock »

tokenadult wrote: post #10

Is it in any sense news that people have developed variant forms of chess? http://www.chessvariants.com/ http://mathworld.wolfram.com/FairyChess.html After all, isn't current Western chess itself a variant of the (possibly Indian) game from which it originated? http://www.tradgames.org.uk/games/Chess.htm http://history.chess.free.fr/history.htm If you know people from China, Taiwan, or Vietnam, you may have had the o…

The main thrust of this article is not the new game she invented.

It's about "irreverence," which is a great word for the concept that for many of us leads to "hacking" - in other words, not limiting ourselves to the status quo or any constraints that are typically perceived by ordinary humans.

The article's takeaway sums it up nicely- Whereas we adults may have to be taught to be irreverent, intellectual irreverence comes naturally to kids, out of sheer ignorance. And although ignorance is generally a vice, for creativity it can be a virtue.

Re: A GeekDad’s 8-Year Old Daughter Reinvents Chess

#18

Post by stcredzero »

tokenadult wrote: post #10

Is it in any sense news that people have developed variant forms of chess? http://www.chessvariants.com/ http://mathworld.wolfram.com/FairyChess.html After all, isn't current Western chess itself a variant of the (possibly Indian) game from which it originated? http://www.tradgames.org.uk/games/Chess.htm http://history.chess.free.fr/history.htm If you know people from China, Taiwan, or Vietnam, you may have had the o…

Here's mine -- "Divorce court chess:"

    QBNRRNBK
    PPPP....
    PPPP....
    ........
    ........
    ....PPPP
    ....PPPP
    KBNRRNBQ
I've played this a number of times. It flummoxes chess experts, and it's actually quite fun. Everyone speculates that it's a solvable game. Believe it or not, but in my brief experience, development of the queen has been a big part of this game.

Re: A GeekDad’s 8-Year Old Daughter Reinvents Chess

#19

Post by [deleted] »

hsmyers wrote: post #13

The age of the daughter is not a surprise--- the number of children who learn chess and happen to be 8 is actually quite large(and no I don't have a citation, this is anecdotal). However of that group the number who the next day or so invent fairy-chess with a Fisher(kind of) variation is probably pretty close to 1! Were I the father, I'd be enormously proud and more than a little stunned. Shaking that off, I'd begin…

[deleted]

Re: A GeekDad’s 8-Year Old Daughter Reinvents Chess

#20

Post by dpcan »

hsmyers wrote: post #13

The age of the daughter is not a surprise--- the number of children who learn chess and happen to be 8 is actually quite large(and no I don't have a citation, this is anecdotal). However of that group the number who the next day or so invent fairy-chess with a Fisher(kind of) variation is probably pretty close to 1! Were I the father, I'd be enormously proud and more than a little stunned. Shaking that off, I'd begin…

Agreed. All my boys were playing chess at 5. However, they have no desire to create a variation. Their #1 goal is to beat Dad.
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