Dropbox Converts to Permanent WFH • Hacker News Board

Re: Dropbox Converts to Permanent WFH

#21

Post by jeffbee » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 2:50 PM UTC

blakesterz wrote: post #6

here's the orginal: https://blog.dropbox.com/topics/company/dropbox-goes-virtual... This was interesting: "Next, we’re embracing what we call “non-linear workdays.” We’re setting core collaboration hours with overlap between time zones, and encouraging employees to design their own schedules beyond that." I've been WFH for about 8 years and have found this just happens naturally. At least for us it did. My team is in…

Dropbox, like all other tech companies where I worked, was already completely informal about office hours. Some people would arrive at noon, others would be leaving.

Re: Dropbox Converts to Permanent WFH

#22

Post by jjmarinho » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 2:51 PM UTC

FlyingSnake wrote: post #3

Companies who go permanent WFH must be saving a fortune on leasing space costs. If these savings don’t make it to the employees who’re using their private space for office work for free, then it’s really bad.

It's not a zero sum game. WFH can simultaneously save money for the company and for the employees.

Re: Dropbox Converts to Permanent WFH

#23

Post by geerlingguy » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 2:51 PM UTC

jopsen wrote: post #17

geerlingguy wrote: post #7

WFH saves money for the company, I just hope that some of the expensive (to the company) perks like prime real estate, free meals, exercise programs, etc. can be translated into at least a minimal budget per employee of: Internet connection reimbursement, annual budget for workspace improvements (ideally with a large initial budget, like $1000 or more for desk, monitor, chair, etc.), and possibly some other perks. Bu…

I somehow don't feel sorry if overpaid tech workers, like me, have to buy a desk and chair. It's not like you need new office furniture very often.

I tend to think of the junior engineers, who might not have a ton of disposable income.

In the before times, they would be put at a workstation with a $2-3000 desk, a $500+ chair, reliable Internet and power, and usually a new(ish) computer, monitor, keyboard, and mouse.

Those engineers don't have the income to get all those pieces for home use; they'll get a cheap Ikea desk and chair, a middling-quality monitor and keyboard, and if they're lucky, their workplace provides a reliable computer at least.

But even for 'overpaid tech workers', there are some tools of the trade you invest in for your own good, but the company should also provide the basics (e.g. reimbursement for things used primarily/exclusively for business).

Re: Dropbox Converts to Permanent WFH

#24

Post by AnIdiotOnTheNet » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 2:51 PM UTC

michaelt wrote: post #12

FlyingSnake wrote: post #3

Companies who go permanent WFH must be saving a fortune on leasing space costs. If these savings don’t make it to the employees who’re using their private space for office work for free, then it’s really bad.

As far as I'm concerned, saving an hour of commute each day more than covers the costs of a desk and using a bit more electricity :)

Indeed. I would gladly take a pay cut to not have to commute if it were an option at my company.

Re: Dropbox Converts to Permanent WFH

#25

Post by dubcanada » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 2:51 PM UTC

geerlingguy wrote: post #7

WFH saves money for the company, I just hope that some of the expensive (to the company) perks like prime real estate, free meals, exercise programs, etc. can be translated into at least a minimal budget per employee of: Internet connection reimbursement, annual budget for workspace improvements (ideally with a large initial budget, like $1000 or more for desk, monitor, chair, etc.), and possibly some other perks. Bu…

My company did internet reimbursement.

But most people don't know that there are massive tax benefits to working from home (at least in Canada) you can write off the percentage of your house you work in of your rent and stuff like that. That alone can equal a $1000 a year or so.

But from a company point of view, getting rid of the office is a massive save in money, so I suspect some will increase salaries or offer other perks such as skipthedishes accounts or what not. Most will just pocket it though.

Re: Dropbox Converts to Permanent WFH

#26

Post by rogerkirkness » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 2:52 PM UTC

geerlingguy wrote: post #7

WFH saves money for the company, I just hope that some of the expensive (to the company) perks like prime real estate, free meals, exercise programs, etc. can be translated into at least a minimal budget per employee of: Internet connection reimbursement, annual budget for workspace improvements (ideally with a large initial budget, like $1000 or more for desk, monitor, chair, etc.), and possibly some other perks. Bu…

We give people $5k for setup (includes PC, though), reimburse cell and internet (and ask them to upgrade) and basically spare no expense on webcam, lighting and ethernet setup.

Re: Dropbox Converts to Permanent WFH

#27

Post by Wowfunhappy » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 2:53 PM UTC

geerlingguy wrote: post #7

WFH saves money for the company, I just hope that some of the expensive (to the company) perks like prime real estate, free meals, exercise programs, etc. can be translated into at least a minimal budget per employee of: Internet connection reimbursement, annual budget for workspace improvements (ideally with a large initial budget, like $1000 or more for desk, monitor, chair, etc.), and possibly some other perks. Bu…

Wouldn't it be easier to compensate for these costs via salary increases? Not everyone will have the same needs, and attempting to track everyone's expenses seems more complicated than necessary.

Although, come to think of it, it might make sense to mark some amount of money as an "equipment stipend" or similar on paychecks. That way, it's clear to both parties what the funds are intended for, even if there's no actual mandate on how to spend them.

Re: Dropbox Converts to Permanent WFH

#28

Post by toomuchtodo » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 2:54 PM UTC

geerlingguy wrote: post #23

jopsen wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I somehow don't feel sorry if overpaid tech workers, like me, have to buy a desk and chair. It's not like you need new office furniture very often.

I tend to think of the junior engineers, who might not have a ton of disposable income. In the before times, they would be put at a workstation with a $2-3000 desk, a $500+ chair, reliable Internet and power, and usually a new(ish) computer, monitor, keyboard, and mouse. Those engineers don't have the income to get all those pieces for home use; they'll get a cheap Ikea desk and chair, a middling-quality monitor and…

I think you'll see something akin to the Joel Test [1], but for how companies manage remote. What equipment are they providing? Are you getting a one time allowance to buy your home office setup (desk, external monitor, etc)? Are you getting a stipend towards your internet connection? Are they providing a corporate managed mobile device (why are you using your personal device for work!?)? Do they provide you with a support contact within the org if you need technical support or are you left to flail on your own? Do you have the option of a coworking space allowance so you're not always having to work from your home? How enjoyable and well put together is your onboarding process?

[1] https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2000/08/09/the-joel-test-12-s...

Re: Dropbox Converts to Permanent WFH

#29

Post by jeffbee » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 2:54 PM UTC

FlyingSnake wrote: post #3

Companies who go permanent WFH must be saving a fortune on leasing space costs. If these savings don’t make it to the employees who’re using their private space for office work for free, then it’s really bad.

In the steady state your point is right, but transiently a lot of companies are holding the bag right now. Dropbox specifically just built a 770000-square-foot headquarters in San Francisco which, let's face it, they didn't need in the first place (they were already trying to sublease 100k sq ft before COVID). Now they're marketing 1/3rd of that space into a massive glut of unwanted SF office space.

Graph of SF office space availability: https://socketsite.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/San-Franci...

Re: Dropbox Converts to Permanent WFH

#30

Post by zinodaur » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 2:55 PM UTC

s9w wrote: post #16

Honestly at this point I would kindly suggest to just fire every employee they have, seeing that every update in the last year made the program worse. Last thing they pulled is making it impossible to pause syncing for more than 24h.

what a nasty thing to say