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The persecution of the Uyghurs is a crime against humanity

economist.com

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Re: The persecution of the Uyghurs is a crime against humanity

#111

Post by rcMgD2BwE72F »

Synaesthesia wrote: post #60
LatteLazy wrote: post #54

I'm no fan of the US, but too many people here are basically saying "the US does bad stuff too". You're not wrong, your point just irrelevant. 2 things can be bad without either excusing the other...

Yes but we must be equally outraged about it. Especially since Americans have more power to change the actions of their own government.

The US also have far more influence on the rest of the world than China (at least for now). As a French, many things happening in the US can have big consequences on my day-to-day life: US military operations directly increases risk of terrorist attacks in Paris (because of NATO or more indirectly), big price moves on the NYSE influence market sentiment in all Western countries, Hollywood movies and Netflix releases change our culture continuously, Google and Facebook privacy changes hits us too, Uber price policy, BLM events actually change perception of police violence in my city within a week, US patent on new cancer drugs, etc. I can't find a single occurrence of a China-centric event that had repercussion on me, my friends or family.

Re: The persecution of the Uyghurs is a crime against humanity

#112

Post by [deleted] »

scotty79 wrote: post #95
onetimemanytime wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

USA, EU members, Canada, Japan, Australia to start have a lot of power to make China think twice. SANCTIONS! Start with small sanctions first and then a sliding scale if they keep going. But good luck getting them all in the same page, they'll try to cheat and cut backroom deals with China.

Nobody sanctioned USA when George W started two wars on a whim against global community. So, no, nobody is going to sanction China, for exactly the same reasons.

[deleted]

Re: The persecution of the Uyghurs is a crime against humanity

#113

Post by hobofan »

benlumen wrote: post #79
Miner49er wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the US really much better than China? We do similar to black, Native American, and immigrant people. I'm not sure I want either winning in their current state.

This is an incredibly low-information perspective that's got to go. China is an authoritarian single-party state where citizens have no liberty, no justice, no recourse. It couldn't be more different to the US. The ongoing demoralization of the US like this is outright sister.

The two-party (with not a huge amount of difference between them) system of the US, with a sitting president that is toying with the idea of staying president for life doesn't really paint a picture of "couldn't be more different" for an outsider.

Re: The persecution of the Uyghurs is a crime against humanity

#114

Post by Subsentient »

Synaesthesia wrote: post #60
LatteLazy wrote: post #54

I'm no fan of the US, but too many people here are basically saying "the US does bad stuff too". You're not wrong, your point just irrelevant. 2 things can be bad without either excusing the other...

Yes but we must be equally outraged about it. Especially since Americans have more power to change the actions of their own government.

No, we do not, because the crimes of the US are not equally severe and/or are historic and not actively occurring.

There's a difference between systemic racism and state-sanctioned cultural genocide signed off on by the dictator himself.

Re: The persecution of the Uyghurs is a crime against humanity

#115

Post by jiuahweruihawi »

herbstein wrote: post #62
zpeti wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US has concentration camps for blacks, native americans and immigrants, where they reeducate you to follow a tyrannical political system? Are they tracked through a social credit system where you can't get a train out of your town if it's bad? Where journalists repeteadly disappear? Where a treaty with the UK is ripped up and a city is invaded? Yeah. Accurate.

Well, the US does have the concentration camps at the border where forced surgeries and sterilizations are being performed.

Those "concentration camps" (a ridiculous misuse of the term) only exist because people of all colors from all across the world are clamoring to move to the US for a better life. Someone had better get them the memo that the US is a tyrannical racist hellhole.

Re: The persecution of the Uyghurs is a crime against humanity

#116

Post by the-dude »

steve_g wrote: post #71
Miner49er wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the US really much better than China? We do similar to black, Native American, and immigrant people. I'm not sure I want either winning in their current state.

I think the US is better. Our last ethnicity-based concentration camps occurred 75 years ago, and have now been repudiated by all branches of government. And we never used the prisoners as organ banks.

I might be mistaken, but I thought Guantanamo Bay is still operational.

Re: The persecution of the Uyghurs is a crime against humanity

#118

Post by ASlave2Gravity »

peteretep wrote: post #84
ASlave2Gravity wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm gonna get a lot of flak for this, but I think there's a massive anti-China narrative on HN. I see so much talk that's based off of people's view from an entirely Western media-centred POV. There's so much more to what's going on. There's a lot of pot calling the kettle black too. There's a lot of good stuff in the TLS from a few weeks back. Han is the cultural race/ethnicity in mainland China. [0] It's about 92%…

> Is China out for world domination, I really don't think so. Every single one of my Chinese friends is about as sweet as they come. ... is this satire? Edit: or do you believe there’s some kind of correlation between some individual Chinese you know and the CPCs plans?

This isn't satire. I knew I was gonna get a lot of flak. I'm sorry to have so many dissagree with me :(. I have no idea what the CPCs plans are. Much like I have no idea what my own goverments (UK) plans are. But what I do see is this kinda news creates a hatered, and that hatered finds it's ways into the culture at large, and I don't think that's a good thing.

e: and yes, I honestly belive that in China things work so diffrently to the West, that a sample of the people can actually give you a good read on what the powers are thinking / doing. Maybe cos they are all brain-washed ;) who really knows. All I'm saying is, let's try and be civil!

Re: The persecution of the Uyghurs is a crime against humanity

#119

Post by baybal2 »

PeterisP wrote: post #53
goku99 wrote: post #12

I don't understand what's the point of UN when these things are happening in a permanent UNSC member country. This C has been causing nuisance to their neighbors all the time. They Debt-Trap poor nations and exploit them. From Mongols to India, every neighbor has a problem, they are probably most worst neighbor you could get. Recently it was in news with yet another conflict with India[1]. This needs to stop. Entire…

The point of UN and UNSC is as a venue to talk about these things and negotiate solutions - it's not like it ever was an option to have an UN that can make binding decisions on the major powers, no major sovereign power would ever agree to that. The default position is that a sovereign nation can do as it pleases; if other nations does not like it, they are welcome to try and force it to change with military power -…

> The point of UN and UNSC is as a venue to talk about these things and negotiate solutions - it's not like it ever was an option to have an UN that can make binding decisions on the major powers, no major sovereign power would ever agree to that.

You know, the original intent of UN was of an organisation to do exactly this. After the second world war, the determination was made that the no pill is too bitter to prevent the next third reich from coming to existence. And that the free nations will spare no price in blood, nations sovereignty, and economic damage to achieve that.

The UN was then sabotaged in its infancy by the very same major powers who vouched to back it. I will let readers to research by themselves who was the biggest proponent of admitting USSR to UN.

The early history of UN was of it being a Western nations club, and a quite potent body. The later didn't fared well with the same major powers in the West. Look who was the biggest opponent of resolution 377 historically https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_General_Assembl...

Re: The persecution of the Uyghurs is a crime against humanity

#120

Post by computerfriend »

pizza234 wrote: post #27
webmobdev wrote: post #10

It's incredibly sad that the world is not doing anything about it. Even if half of the things they say are true - putting anyone in camps for sporting a beard or praying in public, forced prison labour, physical torture, separating new borns and kids from parents in camp, sending kids to brainwashing schools, sexual abuse, organ harvesting etc - it's enough to make anyone feel disgusted at this state of affairs. But…

What can the world realistically do? China right now has enormous power over the rest of the world (by means of economical dependency), and I don't see that decreasing. To be clear, I certainly support human rights, but I personally see the situation as so bad, that I'm worried about how China's influence will extend to the West.

Sanctions, punitive trade policy, rules about government contracts going to Chinese companies, participation in FoN and similar exercises, issuing arrest warrants, making this a factor in immigration / visa / asylum decisions (favourable to those affected, unfavourable to those responsible), etc.

But step one would be just to raise it in a diplomatic context. Most of the world seems unwilling to do even that.

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