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I found black-hat content marketers: sockpuppet bloggers, fake Reddit/HN accts

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Re: I found black-hat content marketers: sockpuppet bloggers, fake Reddit/HN accts

#111

Post by mxcrossb »

I see a lot of “I can’t be hypnotized” comments here. I’ve got bad news for you: you can be hypnotized, advertising works, and comments by astroturfed accounts will affect your view of the world. This is a serious issue for those of us who enjoy content aggregators. What I want to know is what the owners of this site can do to assure readers of the effectiveness of their countermeasures.

Given that I don’t think I’ve ever seen a negative news story about Reddit on Reddit, I think I know their approach.

Re: I found black-hat content marketers: sockpuppet bloggers, fake Reddit/HN accts

#112

Post by [deleted] »

mxcrossb wrote: post #111

I see a lot of “I can’t be hypnotized” comments here. I’ve got bad news for you: you can be hypnotized, advertising works, and comments by astroturfed accounts will affect your view of the world. This is a serious issue for those of us who enjoy content aggregators. What I want to know is what the owners of this site can do to assure readers of the effectiveness of their countermeasures. Given that I don’t think I’ve…

[deleted]

Re: I found black-hat content marketers: sockpuppet bloggers, fake Reddit/HN accts

#113

Post by ineedasername »

cortesoft wrote: post #87
twmahna wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You seem to be refuting claims I never made. I'm simply perplexed that so many people don't know this market exists (as is indicated/suggested by the number of upvotes).

I knew this happens, and I upvoted. Learning details about something I knew about is useful. What makes you think upvotes imply people don’t know this sort of thing exists?

Because Troy Davis, in his tweet, literally said "I didn't know that black-hat content marketing existed"

I think his comments here indicate that what he meant was he wasn't aware it exists "at scale" in this way, but taking the content of the linked post at face value, it's easy to come away thinking "How did he now know this existed?". It's precisely what I thought after reading his tweets, but before seeing his detailed comments here.

Re: I found black-hat content marketers: sockpuppet bloggers, fake Reddit/HN accts

#114

Post by ineedasername »

troydavis wrote: post #3

The Twitter thread has a lot more. There's a person or firm who is doing black-hat content marketing at scale. They either approach freelance bloggers to write articles about their clients (to be submitted to Medium-hosted and similar blogs as if written by unaffiliated users), or create Medium profiles for fake names and write the posts themselves. Posts have appeared in Better Programming, DEV.to, FAUN, freeCodeCam…

Do you know if these were direct clients, or if perhaps they contracted with one entity, which then outsourced it to this shady group?

Re: I found black-hat content marketers: sockpuppet bloggers, fake Reddit/HN accts

#115

Post by unethical_ban »

twmahna wrote: post #31

Is this actually news to people? This has been happening for decades. The purpose is largely for SEO / sometimes for actual traffic. Just go google "private blog networks" (pbn) or "link farm".

It would be news to millions of Americans, for sure, since millions of people know about "the internet" less than they think, and additionally, many millions don't "think like a criminal" to consider how organizations might try to trick people.

And as others have said, even if the behavior weren't surprising, learning about a specific ring of it is.

Re: I found black-hat content marketers: sockpuppet bloggers, fake Reddit/HN accts

#116

Post by unethical_ban »

warent wrote: post #18

I don't endorse this behavior at all but can it really be said to be black-hat? imho seems more gray to me. From what I understand, content _is_ being generated and there are attempts to boost the SEO, so they're providing a service and it's not outright theft. At worst it just sounds like poor practice and gaming the system. They're not acting maliciously, illegally, and/or destructively, which is how I've always de…

Deception for money is malice.

Re: I found black-hat content marketers: sockpuppet bloggers, fake Reddit/HN accts

#117

Post by ineedasername »

bilbo0s wrote: post #77
twmahna wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some examples that come to mind: click fraud, phishing, malware.

That doesn't preclude the techniques we're discussing here, it only adds other techniques to the black hat tool box.

I think the point is that those activities are clearly "black hat", while astroturfing isn't inherently illegal. (well, maybe in some jurisdictions it is. I seem to recall that the UK has much stricter "truth in advertising" laws than the US)

It all exists on a spectrum though, and we can disagree on where the line for black hat is drawn, with no one being wrong because it's a matter of opinion.

Re: I found black-hat content marketers: sockpuppet bloggers, fake Reddit/HN accts

#118

Post by ineedasername »

unethical_ban wrote: post #116
warent wrote: post #18

I don't endorse this behavior at all but can it really be said to be black-hat? imho seems more gray to me. From what I understand, content _is_ being generated and there are attempts to boost the SEO, so they're providing a service and it's not outright theft. At worst it just sounds like poor practice and gaming the system. They're not acting maliciously, illegally, and/or destructively, which is how I've always de…

Deception for money is malice.

I'm confused on your word choice. Malice is generally a more deliberate act of hostility. "Fraudulent" would seem to fit better.

Re: I found black-hat content marketers: sockpuppet bloggers, fake Reddit/HN accts

#120

Post by momokoko »

twmahna wrote: post #31

Is this actually news to people? This has been happening for decades. The purpose is largely for SEO / sometimes for actual traffic. Just go google "private blog networks" (pbn) or "link farm".

This very site denies it happens even though it is often quite obvious.

> Please don't post insinuations about astroturfing, shilling, brigading, foreign agents and the like. It degrades discussion and is usually mistaken. If you're worried about abuse, email hn@ycombinator.com and we'll look at the data.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

If you mention this kind of thing at all, dang will pop in and warn you. You can post all kinds of other crazy stuff, but mention astroturfing or vote manipulation and you will almost always get a response. This is because these sites realize the exact opposite. That the percentage of this stuff is absolutely massive and they are terrified what will happen if the public finds out how common it is.

Its not that people do not realize it happens. It is that the average person is underestimating it by serveral orders of magnitude.

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