Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting • Hacker News Board

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#91

Post by Covzire » Wed, Oct 14, 2020, 9:38 PM UTC

throwawa3495 wrote: post #42

the_only_law wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also interestingly, no denial from Joe Biden about the authenticity of these emails. Wouldnt that be the first thing you'd do if this wasnt true? I assume most politicians at the presidential candidate level have some sort of PR team that works to come up with some official response to these sorts of controversies

"JOE BIDEN SPOKESMAN ANDREW BATES hits back at the N.Y. POST STORY, via NATASHA BERTRAND and KYLE CHENEY: “Investigations by the press, during impeachment, and even by two Republican-led Senate committees whose work was decried as ‘not legitimate’ and political by a GOP colleague have all reached the same conclusion: that Joe Biden carried out official U.S. policy toward Ukraine and engaged in no wrongdoing. Trump Ad…

Why would they have documented illegal/potentially illegal activity in the "official schedule" anyway? The claim that the official schedule somehow supports the rebuttal is pretty flimsy.

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#92

Post by luckylion » Wed, Oct 14, 2020, 9:38 PM UTC

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #8

Whatever your perspective, directly verifiable censorship like this is just begging for legal trouble and monopoly investigations. Tactically speaking, I would say this is a massive mistake from Twitter.

> directly verifiable censorship like this is just begging for legal trouble and monopoly investigations.

If Biden loses. If he wins, it might very well do the opposite.

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#93

Post by SpicyLemonZest » Wed, Oct 14, 2020, 9:38 PM UTC

riffic wrote: post #83

hirundo wrote: post #54

There's a recurring argument on social media censorship that goes: "you wouldn't want the telephone company censoring phone conversations would you?" And the response is along the lines: "these are hardly private conversations, any tweet can go viral and be seen by millions". This story breaks that mold in that it involves social media censoring private conversations via DM. If you think that's OK for Twitter on its…

The difference between the telephone company and Twitter is that the phone company was (historically) a monopoly - the only game in town . Use their wires or get lost. It required common carrier neutrality by regulation. Twitter (and every single commercial social media space) is not the above, and can do what it wants on its service. It's not a public utility.

This seems like an incomplete summary. Shipping companies are subject to similar common carrier regulations, even though they're not monopolies, because "just hire some random guy to drive your packages around" isn't a feasible replacement. In a country where almost everyone with any serious media presence is on Twitter, it's unreasonable to tell certain arbitrary subsets of the media that their thoughts are off limits.

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#94

Post by woeirua » Wed, Oct 14, 2020, 9:39 PM UTC

I think the NY Post story is going to be discredited pretty quickly, and even if it is true, it's nothing new.

That said, I think Twitter massively overreached on their efforts regarding this particular story. It would have been far more effective to just label these tweets as containing potentially misleading information. The story would have died out tomorrow and life would've gone on. Instead this has blown up in their face spectacularly and directly lends credibility to the idea that they have their finger on the scale for Biden. If Trump wins reelection I imagine that he will immediately use the full force of the DOJ against Twitter.

At this point, Twitter might as well just lean into it, and go all out for Biden. They're damned if they do, and damned if they don't, so might as well pick a side and hope that you're on the winning side.

FB might get off here for only "slowing down" the spread of the article, but maybe not.

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#95

Post by cblconfederate » Wed, Oct 14, 2020, 9:39 PM UTC

I 'm really glad that social media are discrediting themselves. Censorship has been going on for years but the blatant covid-powered covert misinformation along with the blatant suppression of competitors might finally turn off enough people away from them. I always though of them as the continuation of reality-show trash TV , which always had an audience but nowhere near to the proportions it has today (even if it's dressed up with makeup and ironed suits). If people learn to finally shut up and listen instead of shouting it will be a good thing for public life. Or they may just realize there's no way to agree and everyone goes their own way. Both are better than a fruitless stalemate.

(easy with the flagging guys. half the comments here are flagged. You re supposed to flag spam not anything that you wish wasnt there. wishful thinking isnt gonna help your cause)

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#96

Post by beervirus » Wed, Oct 14, 2020, 9:40 PM UTC

rmrfstar wrote: post #13

Robert Graham [1] pointed out that if the emails are authentic, they can be trivially verified via DKIM. That the email metadata was not released implies the emails are either inauthentic, or that the post did not contact someone with basic competence in computer forensics. Either possibility seriously undercuts the article's credibility. [1] https://twitter.com/ErrataRob/status/1316407424648179717

Have you ever read an article in the mainstream press that spent space publishing metadata?

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#97

Post by jim-jim-jim » Wed, Oct 14, 2020, 9:41 PM UTC

benmmurphy wrote: post #17

I think it is crazy that twitter has gone down this path. Being the arbiter of truth makes their job much harder and doesn’t seem to have a big upside. If they have an agenda they want to push the upside might be there but otherwise it’s just a perpetual shitshow.

It has a clear upside. I don't think it's a secret at this point that the values of Silicon Valley are in sync with those of the right wing of the Democratic party. These companies are acting in their self interest.

We can make appeals to the ideal of free speech or point out instances of hypocrisy all we want, but it's a futile and demoralizing thing to focus on. It probably makes more sense to view Facebook and Twitter as media outlets with their own editorial agendas, just like the Washington Post, Economist, Daily Mail, etc. And then disengage if their agenda is at odds with yours.

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#98

Post by throwaway4715 » Wed, Oct 14, 2020, 9:41 PM UTC

collective-intl wrote: post #58

bgorman wrote: post #25

The fact that this article is flagged is alarming. This is a relevant news story directly related to how technology companies influence public perception. Like it or not, the New York Post is a widely distributed newspaper in the US. Once the precedent for censoring a newspaper has been established there is nothing stopping facebook for censoring more "upscale" conservative newspapers like the WaLl Street Journal or…

+1 I don't know why you are being downvoted, I think HN's flagging system is another way we are being censored. Just this summer, I remember multiple articles with important, true contributions to our understanding of covid that got flagged. We are losing the ability to consider multiple sides of an issue.

Parent might be flagged because Facebook didn't censor anything. Twitter did.

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#99

Post by cmdshiftf4 » Wed, Oct 14, 2020, 9:41 PM UTC

collective-intl wrote: post #58

bgorman wrote: post #25

The fact that this article is flagged is alarming. This is a relevant news story directly related to how technology companies influence public perception. Like it or not, the New York Post is a widely distributed newspaper in the US. Once the precedent for censoring a newspaper has been established there is nothing stopping facebook for censoring more "upscale" conservative newspapers like the WaLl Street Journal or…

+1 I don't know why you are being downvoted, I think HN's flagging system is another way we are being censored. Just this summer, I remember multiple articles with important, true contributions to our understanding of covid that got flagged. We are losing the ability to consider multiple sides of an issue.

>We are losing the ability to consider multiple sides of an issue

Seems to be long gone, to be honest. We're now at a point where people are de-humanizing those on a different side of an issue to themselves. We unfortunately know what the next step is.

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#100

Post by Covzire » Wed, Oct 14, 2020, 9:42 PM UTC

Let's be honest, the only people screaming for censorship are firmly on the left. Controlling "disinformation" is a dog whistle for censorship, hoping that average citizens don't realize what they're really after. We all know who is going to be the moderators in flagging "disinformation" and we all know which ideology they overwhelmingly favor. I'd sooner trust a pyromaniac as fire chief of my local county than I would trust big tech companies to manage "disinformation" on my behalf.