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PRISM – NSA surveillance program did not prevent a single terrorist attack

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Re: PRISM – NSA surveillance program did not prevent a single terrorist attack

#21

Post by bszupnick »

I'm very much against government (and corporate) spying, but as a mental gymnastic, why was this program a flop?

Assuming it didn't stop one act of terror (as this article assumed/the judge ruled), why?

We know that in the hands of corporations and political machines all of this data can be used with pinpoint accuracy. Is sussing out "who's likely going to commit an act of terror" categorically different than "who's likely to buy a massage from a local spa" or "who's likely to vote for party X"?

Re: PRISM – NSA surveillance program did not prevent a single terrorist attack

#22

Post by arminiusreturns »

0goel0 wrote: post #3
anm89 wrote: post #2

Which is unsurprising given that its goal never had anything to do with terror in the first place.

What do you base that on?

William Binney and Thomas Drake, two of the people who gave Snowden the insight to understand how well "normal channels" work against any whistleblowers.

Binney's thinthread program juxtaposed against what replaced it is a prime thing to start reading up to understand gp's point.

Re: PRISM – NSA surveillance program did not prevent a single terrorist attack

#23

Post by FerretFred »

jagged-chisel wrote: post #4

You'd think if it had stopped any attacks, the program's proponents would be shouting it from the rooftops. But no- nothing. Not even attempts to lie ("oh, we stopped several attacks, but we can't tell you anything about them...") PRISM is a phenomenal waste of trust and money.

"oh, we stopped several attacks, but we can't tell you anything about them..."

This!

Re: PRISM – NSA surveillance program did not prevent a single terrorist attack

#24

Post by djsumdog »

qwerty456127 wrote: post #14

AFAIK, neither did TSA. Sacrificing privacy for security is overrated severely.

America is the only country I've flow through (15+) where you are still required to take off your shoes. It's dumb theater and the TSA is pointless.

Re: PRISM – NSA surveillance program did not prevent a single terrorist attack

#25

Post by hnaccy »

Why is there so little call for reform from congress and new administrations etc?

Obama or Trump had no part in building the original system so why do they continue it? Is the political class as a whole 100% on board with authoritarian, privacy invading, controlling America?

Re: PRISM – NSA surveillance program did not prevent a single terrorist attack

#26

Post by daveevad »

The title is misleading, it appears to me, since the claim "did not prevent a single terrorist attack" isn't backed up with even a grammatically correct sentence.

> a judge ruled beginning of September 2020 that not [one single terrorist attack had been stopped with the help of the NSA's phone surveillance program (sic)

If you trail the linked articles you end up with this 9th circuit opinion:

> The panel wrote that to the extent the public statements of government officials created a contrary impression, that impression is inconsistent with the contents of the classified record.

It's my reading that pertains specifically to the case before the court and not a conclusive determination about the entirety of the PRISM program.

Re: PRISM – NSA surveillance program did not prevent a single terrorist attack

#27

Post by nobleach »

beagle3 wrote: post #16
jagged-chisel wrote: post #4

You'd think if it had stopped any attacks, the program's proponents would be shouting it from the rooftops. But no- nothing. Not even attempts to lie ("oh, we stopped several attacks, but we can't tell you anything about them...") PRISM is a phenomenal waste of trust and money.

> PRISM is a phenomenal waste of trust and money. Only if you believe its stated purpose is its real purpose. I suspect it's actually a huge success if you measure it against its real purpose.

I'm not asking in an accusatory manor, I'm generally curious. What do you think it's real purpose is?

Re: PRISM – NSA surveillance program did not prevent a single terrorist attack

#28

Post by bastardoperator »

jagged-chisel wrote: post #4

You'd think if it had stopped any attacks, the program's proponents would be shouting it from the rooftops. But no- nothing. Not even attempts to lie ("oh, we stopped several attacks, but we can't tell you anything about them...") PRISM is a phenomenal waste of trust and money.

They're not going to tell you about wins or loses, it would be silly to think otherwise. I'm not saying I agree with the program in any capacity, but those of us that have worked with government have a simple saying "loose lips sink ships".

Re: PRISM – NSA surveillance program did not prevent a single terrorist attack

#29

Post by colinmhayes »

djsumdog wrote: post #24
qwerty456127 wrote: post #14

AFAIK, neither did TSA. Sacrificing privacy for security is overrated severely.

America is the only country I've flow through (15+) where you are still required to take off your shoes. It's dumb theater and the TSA is pointless.

Don't have to take your shoes off anymore if you precheck.

Re: PRISM – NSA surveillance program did not prevent a single terrorist attack

#30

Post by zingplex »

corrund wrote: post #9

I prevented one terrorist attack by myself. Nobody knows that, because attack was prevented.

I understand that it is impossible to prove a negative, but at the same time given the scope of the surveillance dragnet I'd hope they'd have something they could point to. At this point I would even circumstantial evidence as to the programs efficacy would go a long way, but it doesn't look like they even have that.
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