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German ship completes historic Arctic expedition

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Re: German ship completes historic Arctic expedition

#31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should probably also feel bad for every living create on earth including for yourself. Their extinction is likely a sign ours might not be so far behind. Edit: Go for the down vote, but the uncomfortable truth is that we're not likely to colonize Mars in 50 years or live underground, we need the biosphere just like these creatures. No level of denial will alter this fact.

At our current rate humans won’t face extinction for thousands of years. We don’t need a biosphere to live in a 5C warmer planet. What will happen is likely massive unrest and famine due to crop shortages leading to a significant population decline. But we can lose 80% of the population and barely be set back 1-2 centuries.

> barely be set back 1-2 centuries

The journey from 1800 to 2000 will likely be harder the second time around. The fall of Rome led to a few unhappy centuries.

And let’s not talk about the the trip back to 1800...

Re: German ship completes historic Arctic expedition

#33
post #32

What confusing maps! Blue ice and white water. There's a clearer map of the actual journey here (along with way more technical info): https://eoportal.org/web/eoportal/satellite-missions/m/mosai...

> What confusing maps! Blue ice and white water.

Bad coloring in schematic maps is something that is driving me crazy. This is especially a problem in maps published by media outlets. Often the water is for example white, and the land is black (like here: https://c8.alamy.com/comp/2C58E1H/map-of-caribbean-region-an...). I am regularly staring at these maps trying to figure out which place on earth it shows, only to realize after 10 seconds or so that it is e.g. Europe, and I was confusing water and land.

Re: German ship completes historic Arctic expedition

#34
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s also common to say stars are dying.

A star is active and full of energy, while ice is just passive and does nothing.

If you want to look at it like that, the melting of sea ice involves the conversion of a lot of energy into destructive sea-level rise.

Re: German ship completes historic Arctic expedition

#35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should probably also feel bad for every living create on earth including for yourself. Their extinction is likely a sign ours might not be so far behind. Edit: Go for the down vote, but the uncomfortable truth is that we're not likely to colonize Mars in 50 years or live underground, we need the biosphere just like these creatures. No level of denial will alter this fact.

At our current rate humans won’t face extinction for thousands of years. We don’t need a biosphere to live in a 5C warmer planet. What will happen is likely massive unrest and famine due to crop shortages leading to a significant population decline. But we can lose 80% of the population and barely be set back 1-2 centuries.

Aside from probably being plain wrong, this sort of thinking is also a germ for boundless evil; from saying "we can lose 80% of the population..." to saying "we should lose 80% of the population so things will be better for the other 20%" and then "let's do something to lose that useless 80% so that ours will be the 20%" is all too small a step.

Re: German ship completes historic Arctic expedition

#36

I feel terrible for the polar bears. I wonder if there is any possibility that they wont go extinct.

I remain optimistic that the human race will figure things out before we completely decimate all ocean life and before we make half of the planet inhospitable. However, I am certain the powers that be will not take any action until MAJOR death waves in the western world such as the destruction of a major picturesque city from a freak weather event. Before that, I expect we will lose: * Polar bears * Wild Tuna * Wild…

As someone who has direct connections into a part of the research community looking at the sustainability of fishing in the north Atlantic in regards to the real and ongoing acidification of the ocean as well as the policy making over the last few decades I would say that your optimism is misplaced.

There is really nothing being done at the scale needed to avert catastrophic collapse of the ocean food chains.

Re: German ship completes historic Arctic expedition

#37

The Polarstern ("Pole Star") is a ship of the AWI (Alfred-Wegener-Institute [0]). Another project of theirs, which you might know from images because it has a characteristic look, is the current Neumayer-Station [1][2]. It sits on columns that can hydraulically raise and lower the station to adapt to different heights of snow. This is off-topic but you might like it as well. The station is of course host to experimen…

Tangentially, there's a great bit in Patti Smith's book M Train about joining a society dedicated to Wegener's memory:

> Formed in the early 1980s by a Danish meteorologist, the Continental Drift Club is an obscure society serving as an independent branch of the earth-science community. Twenty-seven members, scattered across the hemispheres, have pledged their dedication to the perpetuation of remembrance, specifically in regard to Alfred Wegener, who pioneered the theory of continental drift. The bylaws require discretion, attendance at the biannual conferences, a certain amount of applicable fieldwork, and a reasonable passion for the club’s reading list. All are expected to keep abreast of the activities of the Alfred Wegener Institute for Polar and Marine Research, in the city of Bremerhaven in Lower Saxony.

> I was granted membership of the CDC quite by accident. On the whole, members are primarily mathematicians, geologists, and theologians and are identified not by name but by a given number. I had written several letters to the Alfred Wegener Institute searching for a living heir in hopes of obtaining permission to photograph the great explorer’s boots. One of my letters was forwarded to the secretary of the Continental Drift Club, and after a flurry of correspondence I was invited to attend their 2005 conference in Bremen, which coincided with the 125th anniversary of the great geoscientist’s birth and thus the 75th of his death. I attended their panel discussions, a special screening at City 46 of Research and Adventure on the Ice, a documentary series containing rare footage of Wegener’s 1929 and 1930 expeditions, and joined them for a private tour of the AWI facilities in nearby Bremerhaven. I am certain I didn’t quite meet their criteria, but I suspect that after some deliberation they welcomed me due to my abundance of romantic enthusiasm. I became an official member in 2006, and was given the number 23.

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2015/sep/27/patti-smith-m-...

Re: German ship completes historic Arctic expedition

#38
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At our current rate humans won’t face extinction for thousands of years. We don’t need a biosphere to live in a 5C warmer planet. What will happen is likely massive unrest and famine due to crop shortages leading to a significant population decline. But we can lose 80% of the population and barely be set back 1-2 centuries.

> barely be set back 1-2 centuries The journey from 1800 to 2000 will likely be harder the second time around. The fall of Rome led to a few unhappy centuries. And let’s not talk about the the trip back to 1800...

We also used up all the easy carbon reserves. Not obvious we could bounce back easily if we go to a before the industrial revolution level of technology.

Re: German ship completes historic Arctic expedition

#39
I only heard about this expedition after it was finished. I would have loved to follow their daily updates, but seems like too much work to go through them here afterwards.

Does anyone have a good idea about where news about this type of expeditions are shared up front? I searched to subreddits called something with "expedition" but no luck. So all ideas are welcome. Even more cool would of course be to join an expedition like this - but following one must be second best.

Re: German ship completes historic Arctic expedition

#40
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A star is active and full of energy, while ice is just passive and does nothing.

If you want to look at it like that, the melting of sea ice involves the conversion of a lot of energy into destructive sea-level rise.

Melting of sea ice doesn't cause sea level rise:

https://www.jpl.nasa.gov/edu/teach/activity/whats-causing-se...

NB It causes a lot of other problems - but apparently not that one (at least not directly).

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