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There's another right to repair fight brewing in Massachusetts

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Re: There's another right to repair fight brewing in Massachusetts

#41

Post by cycloptic »

nessunodoro wrote: post #4
hprotagonist wrote: post #2

The No side's ads are incredibly scummy. The retired boston police commissioner has done an ad spot for Yes on Right To Repair specifically to slap down the "you will be raped in a parking lot" FUD: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bye5DRBSpw The EFF is also strongly in favor, naturally, but i think Ed Davis will pull more weight if anyone's undecided. (when marijuana legalization was on the ballot in 2016, the then-…

Scummy is a polite word for the advertisements. It's been fascinating to watch them evolve in waves. First wave: POV of a predator in a parking garage approaching a woman. Grave female voiceover: "Sexual predators could track your automobile, and remotely control the vehicle - including unlocking the doors." The female victim turns as the camera descends on her - she screams - "Vote No on Question 1. Don't let sexual…

Ha, as if auto manufacturers all have an org dedicated to monitoring and deterring sexual predators and Russian hackers. Can anyone from one of these companies comment on this? Can I get a discount if I opt out of that at the dealership? I'm a techie, really I'd prefer to install Windows Defender on the car myself, thank you!

Re: There's another right to repair fight brewing in Massachusetts

#42

Post by acomjean »

dsr_ wrote: post #6

Massachusetts sends out a voting guide: Massachusetts Information for Voters. It's the red cover brochure. If you look at the Against side of Question 1, the largest paragraph is from Jane Doe, the MA Coalition Against Sexual Assault and Domestic Violence. Jane Doe, Inc. has retracted their support, but it was too late for the brochure to be updated.

The mass voting guide is something to behold. I missed it when I left the state for a few years.

It’s online and has a summary of the pro/con argument and the full text of the ballot measure.

https://www.sec.state.ma.us/ele/elepdf/IFV_2020.pdf

The independent repair shops with the “yes on one” signs I think help more than any sign I’ve seen. As stated by others there have been a lot of ads about this.

Re: There's another right to repair fight brewing in Massachusetts

#43

Post by acomjean »

The bill is summaraized in the voting guide which also has the full text.

I’m voting yes.

PDF of Massachusetts guide to the ballot question. It has a nice summmary and the legalease versión too.

https://www.sec.state.ma.us/ele/elepdf/IFV_2020.pdf .... Commencing in model year 2022 and thereafter a manufacturer of motor vehicles sold in the Commonwealth, including heavy duty vehicles having a gross vehicle weight rating of more than 14,000 pounds, that utilizes a telematics system shall be required to equip such vehicles with an inter-operable, standardized and open access platform across all of the manufacturer’s makes and models. Such platform shall be capable of securely communicating all mechanical data emanating directly from the motor vehicle via direct data connection to the platform. Such platform shall be directly accessible by the owner of the vehicle through a mobile-based application and, upon the authorization of the vehicle owner, all mechanical data shall be directly accessible by an independent repair facility or a class 1 dealer licensed pursuant to section 58 of chapter 140 limited to the time to complete the repair or for a period of time agreed to by the vehicle owner for the purposes of maintaining, diagnosing and repairing the motor vehicle. Access shall include the ability to send commands to in-vehicle components if needed for purposes of maintenance, diagnostics and repair. SECTION 4.........

Re: There's another right to repair fight brewing in Massachusetts

#44

Post by Nextgrid »

jghn wrote: post #15
hprotagonist wrote: post #2

The No side's ads are incredibly scummy. The retired boston police commissioner has done an ad spot for Yes on Right To Repair specifically to slap down the "you will be raped in a parking lot" FUD: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bye5DRBSpw The EFF is also strongly in favor, naturally, but i think Ed Davis will pull more weight if anyone's undecided. (when marijuana legalization was on the ballot in 2016, the then-…

They're incredibly scummy but a super thin veneer. I don't know how anyone buys their BS. On one hand they feature grease monkeys talking about people hacking your car, I'm not sure people should be using their local mechanic for cybersecurity advice. More important, the fine print at the end makes it clear that it's the auto manufacturers sponsoring those ads, and their bias is obvious. I'll lose some faith in human…

We live in a society where conspiracy theories based on lies, lack of knowledge or pure insanity trump actual scientific facts, and where basic health tools such as masks have been politicized.

In such a society I would be (pleasantly) surprised if the majority doesn't buy this BS.

Re: There's another right to repair fight brewing in Massachusetts

#45

Post by TeeMassive »

I'm seeing videos suggested by the YouTube algorithm from time to time about the Right to Repair and nothing is more infuriating then watching those people who basically sold their soul to say things that are not only blatantly baseless but also which are very against the public interest and will have negative impact on the environment for the generations to come.

Re: There's another right to repair fight brewing in Massachusetts

#46

Post by acomjean »

godelski wrote: post #39
nessunodoro wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Scummy is a polite word for the advertisements. It's been fascinating to watch them evolve in waves. First wave: POV of a predator in a parking garage approaching a woman. Grave female voiceover: "Sexual predators could track your automobile, and remotely control the vehicle - including unlocking the doors." The female victim turns as the camera descends on her - she screams - "Vote No on Question 1. Don't let sexual…

Do you have links to these videos? They sound hilarious.

Con side

https://safeandsecuredata.org/

(They have a youtube)

https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCGB8blHHwEhHILzENXb1_9g

This is the fear spot shown:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NYp2_oiwtIg

Pro side

https://massrighttorepair.org/

They have a youtube Channel too (which is Massachusetts in a nutshell):

https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCYOxd_3siXOYMrUvdJQDMOA

They pulled the former police commissioner to rebut some of the fear in a second ad. And this animated one with strong local accents

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pYmViMg5fQI

Re: There's another right to repair fight brewing in Massachusetts

#47

Post by jrumbut »

dmqctx wrote: post #19
geophile wrote: post #3

The only thing holding me back from a yes vote is the availability of detailed location data to 3rd parties. Can a mechanic sell this data? Can it be subpoenaed by police?

What use is location based information to a repair shop? Is it simply that opening up this dealer-only content to 3rd parties will in turn share the location data? I can't see any benefit in sharing location specific info to a shop. Why not have the bill insulate that type of data...walled off, for dealer and owner only to access.

Of no use to them, but perhaps a valuable thing they can sell to others (insurance companies, marketers, spies, etc).

I'd really rather my car not gather that much data to start with. My phone provides all the mobile compute and navigation (and privacy invasion) I need. I don't think historical telemetry data of any kind is going to deliver extra value to me, the car owner. Every extra feature in a car is just another thing that breaks.

Re: There's another right to repair fight brewing in Massachusetts

#48

Post by Polylactic_acid »

elihu wrote: post #14
hprotagonist wrote: post #2

The No side's ads are incredibly scummy. The retired boston police commissioner has done an ad spot for Yes on Right To Repair specifically to slap down the "you will be raped in a parking lot" FUD: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bye5DRBSpw The EFF is also strongly in favor, naturally, but i think Ed Davis will pull more weight if anyone's undecided. (when marijuana legalization was on the ballot in 2016, the then-…

That Yes ad raises more questions than it answers. What constitutes mechanical data? Does it include timestamps of when the engine was running and for how long? Is location data explicitly excluded? What about data that could be used to infer location, like vibration sensors picking up pothole impacts or gravel roads? It seems simpler to just say: "This bill gives you, the owner of the vehicle, the right to give acce…

If you are actually a potential rapist there are plenty of easier methods than setting up a fake repair garage and matching vibration sensors with pot holes. The entire idea is ridiculous.

Re: There's another right to repair fight brewing in Massachusetts

#49

Post by cheweh »

nessunodoro wrote: post #4
hprotagonist wrote: post #2

The No side's ads are incredibly scummy. The retired boston police commissioner has done an ad spot for Yes on Right To Repair specifically to slap down the "you will be raped in a parking lot" FUD: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bye5DRBSpw The EFF is also strongly in favor, naturally, but i think Ed Davis will pull more weight if anyone's undecided. (when marijuana legalization was on the ballot in 2016, the then-…

Scummy is a polite word for the advertisements. It's been fascinating to watch them evolve in waves. First wave: POV of a predator in a parking garage approaching a woman. Grave female voiceover: "Sexual predators could track your automobile, and remotely control the vehicle - including unlocking the doors." The female victim turns as the camera descends on her - she screams - "Vote No on Question 1. Don't let sexual…

Over $23 million paid by automakers funded these scummy advertisements. Thankfully we know this from campaign finance transparency. The ads say in fine print that they are paid for by the "Coalition for Safe and Secure Data" and that top donors include "the Alliance for Automotive Innovation."

A Coalition campaign finance report from 2020 [0] shows $23 million in receipts from the likes of Ford Motor Company, General Motors, Toyota, Honda, Nissan, and others.

Expenditures in that report show who is helping them produce these ads.

[0] https://www.ocpf.us/Reports/DisplayReport?menuHidden=true&id...

Re: There's another right to repair fight brewing in Massachusetts

#50

Post by b112 »

jghn wrote: post #15
hprotagonist wrote: post #2

The No side's ads are incredibly scummy. The retired boston police commissioner has done an ad spot for Yes on Right To Repair specifically to slap down the "you will be raped in a parking lot" FUD: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bye5DRBSpw The EFF is also strongly in favor, naturally, but i think Ed Davis will pull more weight if anyone's undecided. (when marijuana legalization was on the ballot in 2016, the then-…

They're incredibly scummy but a super thin veneer. I don't know how anyone buys their BS. On one hand they feature grease monkeys talking about people hacking your car, I'm not sure people should be using their local mechanic for cybersecurity advice. More important, the fine print at the end makes it clear that it's the auto manufacturers sponsoring those ads, and their bias is obvious. I'll lose some faith in human…

What I don't get is, why hasn't anyone stated the obvious.

Why do cars have location data stored onboard? Personal information? GPS data?

I have a phone, which already has stupid levels of personal info in it. Who on Earth needs another phone in their car, tracking everything, watching where I drive, who I call, on and on and on.

I don't get it. No one needs any of this crap in a car.

Take a phone for example, terrible security updates (eg, many phones barely have them last the terms of a 2 or 3 year contract). Then? Nada!

So how does that relate to my car? Lots of people keep cars for a decade.

Where are my free security updates, to all aspects of these network connected, wifi enabled, cars?

You think GM is going to give you a security update on a 10 year old platform?

It's a car, yet it's treated like the most horrid of things by GM/others, an IOT connected device.

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