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Removing Holocaust Denial Content

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Re: Removing Holocaust Denial Content

#161
post #145

Admirable move. I think Facebook (and all its properties), Twitter, and other hyper-connected social networks must show a healthy level of intolerance towards groups and ideologies that are beyond reason and recall, especially when those said groups are overtly and unmistakably intolerant themselves. This heavy-handedness isn't an encroachment on free speech but a necessary impediment to keep the spirit of free speec…

Popper never said anything of the sort. Quoting from the same link you posted: "The term "paradox of tolerance" does not appear anywhere in the main text of The Open Society and Its Enemies. Rather, Popper lists the above as a note to chapter 7, among the mentioned paradoxes proposed by Plato in his apologia for "benevolent despotism"—i.e., true tolerance would inevitably lead to intolerance, so autocratic rule of an…

Why would you want the death of somebody for merely holding an opinion, no matter what that opinion is? That was a pretty WTF moment while reading your comment.

Re: Removing Holocaust Denial Content

#162

Great. What should we do with content that glorifies or lies about the genocide of indigenous people in the Americas (e.g. anything that glorifies Columbus and the history implied by Thanks Giving Day) Same goes for content that aligns with current day denial that racism is a huge problem in this country and across the globe? In the end, it's the same net result: people die of hate crimes because of lack of awareness…

Well, there's Columbus statues being torn down (https://www.google.com/search?q=columbus+statue+removed) and movements to change the curriculum wrt Columbus and the early invaders/colonists, so there's that. It took a while, but it's moving in the right direction. I'm sure that if it becomes a bigger thing, Facebook will add fact checking and additional information with regards to that as well. I hope so anyway.

Re: Removing Holocaust Denial Content

#163
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's been shown that deplatforming and moving those nuts out of the mainstream social media channels reduce their influence. There was holocaust denier before Faceook, but their reach was much more limited. Remember that Facebook promotes groups and suggest you content that you're not following, so when holocaust deniers are part of the platform, some people with no exposure to the concept might start getting recomme…

> It's been shown that deplatforming and moving those nuts out of the mainstream social media channels reduce their influence. Would you mind linking to the studies you have in mind? In thinking about the likes of The_Donald and its current, banished form.

I got curious about it's current, banished form because I'd missed that bit of the story. It's about what I'd expect except they have a non-CCDA compliant cookie notice with no opt-out. Makes me wonder if that's because they have amateur web devs or if the management didn't want to include it because California and politics.

Re: Removing Holocaust Denial Content

#164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a healthy level of intolerance towards groups and ideologies that are beyond reason and recall How can you tell if they are beyond reason if you are not allowed to read their arguments?

I draw the line at hate. If one side wants to destroy me do I have to listen to their arguments?

No you don't have to listen, you can walk away.

Re: Removing Holocaust Denial Content

#165

Censoring opposition has not once yielded positive results in the history of the world. My personal conspiracy theory is that policies like these are subversively being used to push HD since no one could possibly be stupid enough to think this would help.

Hasn’t it? Do you have any examples, or should I just take your word for it?

"Sometimes Less Is More: Censorship, News Falsification, and Disapproval"

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/ajps.12501

Re: Removing Holocaust Denial Content

#166

Admirable move. I think Facebook (and all its properties), Twitter, and other hyper-connected social networks must show a healthy level of intolerance towards groups and ideologies that are beyond reason and recall, especially when those said groups are overtly and unmistakably intolerant themselves. This heavy-handedness isn't an encroachment on free speech but a necessary impediment to keep the spirit of free speec…

Almost any kind of censorship could be justified with the argument that some voices are "drained out" by others, so to protect the former, the latter most be censored, which is not actually "an encroachment on free speech but a necessary impediment to keep the spirit of free speech and free society intact". WTF does this mean? The internet is not a room where some people have to be silent so that you can hear the oth…

> You can simply ignore people you don't like, or you deem "intolerant", etc.

No, that's not how the Internet - or people in general - work.

Re: Removing Holocaust Denial Content

#167

"Unfortunately, even while the protests about the cartoons were still underway, a new problem about convincing Muslims of the genuineness of our respect for freedom of expression has arisen because of Austria's conviction and imprisonment of David Irving for denying the existence of the Holocaust. We cannot consistently hold that it should be a criminal offense to deny the existence of the Holocaust and that cartooni…

It is avery strong way to publicly, and legally, counter that specific case of propanda and falsehoods. Extending that to social media can only be a good thing. It also makes it very clear, that everyone agreeing with people like Irving, and following them, is aslo most likely a Nazi.

And these claims have been refuted so often already, that not everyone making these claims has to be refuted on an individual basis.

Re: Removing Holocaust Denial Content

#168

Admirable move. I think Facebook (and all its properties), Twitter, and other hyper-connected social networks must show a healthy level of intolerance towards groups and ideologies that are beyond reason and recall, especially when those said groups are overtly and unmistakably intolerant themselves. This heavy-handedness isn't an encroachment on free speech but a necessary impediment to keep the spirit of free speec…

You either have free speech or not. When Facebook censors something, it means that there's no free speech on this platform. Whether you're censoring holocaust denial, global warmth denial, Stalin is evil denial, BLM denial, spherical earth denial, it matters not. You can't define what is beyond reason.

Re: Removing Holocaust Denial Content

#169

I don't think that's the best approach. I like it better how it can be done at e.g. reddit: make other groups able to link to the content/discussion and show this link to the reader of the original content. Then the reader gets to notice that the topic is controversial and discussed in other places and can make up their own idea based on different views. It shouldn't be difficult to convince a naive reader of conspir…

> I like it better how it can be done at e.g. reddit

Reddit is heavily censored. Content is removed, subreddits are removed and people are banned and shadow-banned.

Re: Removing Holocaust Denial Content

#170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a healthy level of intolerance towards groups and ideologies that are beyond reason and recall How can you tell if they are beyond reason if you are not allowed to read their arguments?

I draw the line at hate. If one side wants to destroy me do I have to listen to their arguments?

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