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A 20-year-old CRT monitor can be better than a 4K LCD (2019)

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Re: A 20-year-old CRT monitor can be better than a 4K LCD (2019)

#111
post #3

TL;DR: For gaming, because ‘input lag’. [In a CRT] the electron-to-photon exchange happens instantly. While CRTs do have some sources of lag —namely, the time spent buffering each video frame and scanning each line of the frame from top to bottom on the screen —those delays are on the order of microseconds. When you move your mouse or press a button on the keyboard, the response time is imperceptible... By contrast,…

The description is actually not very good.

Input lag doesn't purely exist because of liquid movement and pixels changing colors. If it would, then an input lag of 50-100ms (which where common with older generation LCDs) - would also mean the screens response time (the time to change color) would be that high. Which would mean your picture would be a blurry mess.

The majority of input lag came from additional signal processing algorithms which were built into LCDs, which buffered the full picture for 1-2 frames. E.g. to apply overdrive algorithms, color correction, scaling, etc. Those are all running before the signal gets towards the crystals.

I think a lot of that was actually just bad design in the earlier generation of LCDs. And it was really bad, I had a screen with 100ms input lag and neither working nor gaming on it was really fun.

But it seems like manufacturers now understand the problem better and try to minimize the delay through signal processing.

Re: A 20-year-old CRT monitor can be better than a 4K LCD (2019)

#112
Ah man, memories, and not from 20 years ago, either. I bought a top-of-the-line 21" Trinitron in 1999 and after 4.99 years of the 5-year warranty something stopped working inside it so I shipped it back to Sony and they couldn't or didn't want to fix it and they didn't have any more to replace it so they shipped me a new 24" GDM-FW900 for free, which gave me years of trouble-free service. Eventually I had to get rid of it because video cards with respectable analog outputs became scarce. Younger computer users never had to deal with this but in the late stages of CRT technology the quality of the analog end of the video card (the RAMDAC) was a major differentiation between brands. Having a quality RAMDAC and a quality cable of minimal length made a visible difference in the resulting picture.

Re: A 20-year-old CRT monitor can be better than a 4K LCD (2019)

#115

Also, a 20-year-old CRT monitor (21") consumes almost four times the electricity of an LCD, and can cost about 5x more to run-even with energy saving mode.

Gamers aren't really known to go out of their ways to save 100 or 200W.

Re: A 20-year-old CRT monitor can be better than a 4K LCD (2019)

#117
I had one of those that a programmer that worked for me sold me.

It did cost him something like $6000-9000 new.

The image was incredible, but it had lots of drawbacks:

1. It was huge and heavyweight. Most people that say "people obsession with flatness" has never expirienced having an screen that is as deep as long and tall. Attaching it to the wall was a nightmare.

2. It had problems with magnets. I put a big magnet like 1 meter away and it affected the screen.

3. It emitted X-Rays directly to your eyes. Not good.

In the end replacing it with LCDs was a great decision. Much better for the programming or CAD that I do.

OLED is great, as the article says, if you can buy-recover the cost somewhat.

Re: A 20-year-old CRT monitor can be better than a 4K LCD (2019)

#118
post #4

I have a different problem with LCDs. I still think they're too bright. With a CRT you could set everything to white on black and you had almost no light coming out of the screen. Also brightness meant brightness and you could turn it way down for when working in dim light or darkness. Of course i'm talking about text work here. Maybe when OLED monitors become affordable we'll go back to monitors that aren't basicall…

VA panels have by far the blackest blacks of any LCD technology. Viewing angles and uniformity aren't as good as IPS, but they're the best option if you care about contrast.

https://www.rtings.com/monitor/tests/picture-quality/contras...

Re: A 20-year-old CRT monitor can be better than a 4K LCD (2019)

#119
post #9
post #4

I have a different problem with LCDs. I still think they're too bright. With a CRT you could set everything to white on black and you had almost no light coming out of the screen. Also brightness meant brightness and you could turn it way down for when working in dim light or darkness. Of course i'm talking about text work here. Maybe when OLED monitors become affordable we'll go back to monitors that aren't basicall…

Yeah I have no idea why the lowest levels on monitors are so bright. Are there models that can go really low without the PWM flicker effect kicking in (that's another problem I have with monitors, I can notice the damn cheap PWM backlight)? Laptop (and phone) displays don't seem to have this problem, the brightness goes really low...

The vast majority of modern high-quality monitors have flicker-free backlights without PWM dimming.

https://www.rtings.com/monitor/tests/motion/image-flicker

Re: A 20-year-old CRT monitor can be better than a 4K LCD (2019)

#120

Heh, everything is better on Tubes whether it is guitar amps or gaming monitors? :-) I can pretty much assure you that with a 240Hz refresh rate 4K LCD monitor it will look better than your CRT :-) But it is perfectly valid to say "What is the best experience I can get for $X?" and find that CRT solutions out perform LCD solutions at various price points. That said, I suspect it is less about the "superiority" of the…

It seems like 4k is pretty darned wasteful part of the hedonic treadmill. At a more reasonable resolution, this processing power could be used for higher-end graphics algorithms, better AI, longer battery life, and so on.
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