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Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

reuters.com

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Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#211

Post by Udik »

dragontamer wrote: post #207
ajxs wrote: post #206

I always find it disheartening that people see the propagation of 'bad' information on social-media networks as a bigger risk to society than said networks becoming the gatekeepers of all propagated information. The term 'Orwellian' has become so overused that it seems to have lost all currency. When we're confronted with an actually Orwellian phenomena people seem to either not notice or not care. It's not as though…

My mom believes that Obama is a Muslim, and my sister believes Breonna Taylor was a criminal who got what she deserved. The disinformation in our social networks is beyond a breaking point. Its incredibly difficult to have a reasonable discussion when alternative facts exist... I dare say impossible. ----- What is your plan to deal with the disinformation here? While my mother is over the age of 60, I don't believe h…

> My mom believes that Obama is a Muslim, and my sister believes Breonna Taylor was a criminal who got what she deserved.

That is an interesting example because while Obama is factually not a Muslim, period, the question about what Breonna Taylor "deserved" is a political one- a matter of opinions. So you're putting in the same bucket objectively fake information and opinions with which you strongly disagree, and calling for measures that can prevent both from spreading.

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#212

Post by bilg21 »

intrasight wrote: post #165
drawkbox wrote: post #33

Repeat after me, social media is not reality. Social media is the new tabloid salacious media. Yes it can be fun, entertaining, informative and educational, it can also be propaganda, misinformation, astroturfing, and a big high school like popularity contest where people are fake and narcissistic but probably insecure. The truth is the internet is teaching the biggest lesson ever in critical thinking and getting you…

I have hundreds of Facebook friends. I read their posts or add my own posts perhaps twice a day. 90% are status updates and/or photos of what they are up to. I find it extremely useful. It's a micro-blogging service. When did this moniker "social media" come into being? What does that even mean? I should say that I have everything except direct posts disabled - including all "shares" and all ads - and that's why to m…

Would you mind sharing how you've disabled ads and shares? I could not find such options in facebook settings. Only thing I can think of is adblock or writing my own software to pull feeds and filter them.

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#213

Post by dragontamer »

Udik wrote: post #211
dragontamer wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My mom believes that Obama is a Muslim, and my sister believes Breonna Taylor was a criminal who got what she deserved. The disinformation in our social networks is beyond a breaking point. Its incredibly difficult to have a reasonable discussion when alternative facts exist... I dare say impossible. ----- What is your plan to deal with the disinformation here? While my mother is over the age of 60, I don't believe h…

> My mom believes that Obama is a Muslim, and my sister believes Breonna Taylor was a criminal who got what she deserved. That is an interesting example because while Obama is factually not a Muslim, period, the question about what Breonna Taylor "deserved" is a political one- a matter of opinions. So you're putting in the same bucket objectively fake information and opinions with which you strongly disagree, and cal…

Perhaps I was too vague on the Breonna Taylor example. Let me clarify: My sister was arguing with me that Breonna Taylor was a drug dealer. Which is as factually wrong as the "Obama is a Muslim" comments.

EDIT: Note that the warrant in the case was for Jamarcus Glover. I can accept Jamarcus Glover being a drug dealer (or having some connection to drugs), but seeing Breonna Taylor wrapped up in the drug charges is clearly misinformation.

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#214

Post by ajxs »

dragontamer wrote: post #207
ajxs wrote: post #206

I always find it disheartening that people see the propagation of 'bad' information on social-media networks as a bigger risk to society than said networks becoming the gatekeepers of all propagated information. The term 'Orwellian' has become so overused that it seems to have lost all currency. When we're confronted with an actually Orwellian phenomena people seem to either not notice or not care. It's not as though…

My mom believes that Obama is a Muslim, and my sister believes Breonna Taylor was a criminal who got what she deserved. The disinformation in our social networks is beyond a breaking point. Its incredibly difficult to have a reasonable discussion when alternative facts exist... I dare say impossible. ----- What is your plan to deal with the disinformation here? While my mother is over the age of 60, I don't believe h…

> Its an issue of disinformation, not stupidity, that's leading people down the wrong path...

You're wrong. The difficulty has always been that the most pervasive so-called 'misinformation' is usually fairly plausible, difficult to validate, or simply matters of opinion or interpretation. The notion that Obama is a Muslim strains credulity, and it's not a widely held belief. What about more complex information, such as religious or political texts? These are even more difficult to validate and cause much more harm. Maybe we should just outright ban the communist manifesto? That seems to have caused a large amount of social harm and could be fairly readily classified as 'disinformation'. What about the Christian bible? The Koran? They're full of difficult to validate claims.

> What is your plan to deal with the disinformation here?

What disinformation? The information you don't like, or the information I don't like?

> We're not in an Orwellian fantasy, we're in an all-out information-war... > Several groups have learned how to weaponize information for their own gain...

The fact that you seem to see that information has been weaponised, but can't seem to see that big-tech's censorship is pursuant to their own political aspirations is alarming. Are you legitimately this biased, or just being disingenuous?

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#215

Post by rbecker »

dragontamer wrote: post #207
ajxs wrote: post #206

I always find it disheartening that people see the propagation of 'bad' information on social-media networks as a bigger risk to society than said networks becoming the gatekeepers of all propagated information. The term 'Orwellian' has become so overused that it seems to have lost all currency. When we're confronted with an actually Orwellian phenomena people seem to either not notice or not care. It's not as though…

My mom believes that Obama is a Muslim, and my sister believes Breonna Taylor was a criminal who got what she deserved. The disinformation in our social networks is beyond a breaking point. Its incredibly difficult to have a reasonable discussion when alternative facts exist... I dare say impossible. ----- What is your plan to deal with the disinformation here? While my mother is over the age of 60, I don't believe h…

> Several groups have learned how to weaponize information for their own gain. At first it was just ads

Weaponized information is not new. It's just usually more subtle. A few examples:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welcome_to_Marwen cast the attackers as all white and one with swastika tattoo, even though they had no such tattoo, and one was black.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hurricane_(1999_film) in addition to many other inaccuracies, shows the white vs. black match as a racist fix, which was such a fabrication that "Even Carter himself agreed that Giardello was the rightful victor.", and Giardello sued and settled out of court for damages.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Accused_(1988_film) was loosely based on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheryl_Araujo where all the rapists were Hispanic, but in the movie, they're all white.

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#216

Post by dragontamer »

ajxs wrote: post #214
dragontamer wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My mom believes that Obama is a Muslim, and my sister believes Breonna Taylor was a criminal who got what she deserved. The disinformation in our social networks is beyond a breaking point. Its incredibly difficult to have a reasonable discussion when alternative facts exist... I dare say impossible. ----- What is your plan to deal with the disinformation here? While my mother is over the age of 60, I don't believe h…

> Its an issue of disinformation, not stupidity, that's leading people down the wrong path... You're wrong. The difficulty has always been that the most pervasive so-called 'misinformation' is usually fairly plausible, difficult to validate, or simply matters of opinion or interpretation. The notion that Obama is a Muslim strains credulity, and it's not a widely held belief. What about more complex information, such…

> The notion that Obama is a Muslim strains credulity, and it's not a widely held belief.

Its a held belief in my family. My very mother, my uncles, and more. Whether or not it is "widely held" has little-to-no bearing on the seriousness I take it.

Since my mother believes in it, I will take the alternative fact seriously.

> What disinformation? The information you don't like, or the information I don't like?

Disinformation like: Obama is a Muslim (or Obama was born in Kenya). Surely you can agree with me that such a fact running across political discussions is unhelpful.

> but can't seem to see that big-tech's censorship is pursuant to their own political aspirations is alarming

I'm prioritizing issues. I see misinformation / alternative facts to be a bigger problem than big-tech's censorship. As such, I'll stand in support of big-tech's moves here, if it helps the misinformation problem.

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#217

Post by tshaddox »

ajxs wrote: post #206

I always find it disheartening that people see the propagation of 'bad' information on social-media networks as a bigger risk to society than said networks becoming the gatekeepers of all propagated information. The term 'Orwellian' has become so overused that it seems to have lost all currency. When we're confronted with an actually Orwellian phenomena people seem to either not notice or not care. It's not as though…

> I always find it disheartening that people see the propagation of 'bad' information on social-media networks as a bigger risk to society than said networks becoming the gatekeepers of all propagated information.

Who thinks this? Are you just assuming that anyone who approves of social media networks removing disinformation also thinks that is a bigger problem than the social media networks being powerful gatekeepers?

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#218

Post by dunnevens »

ajxs wrote: post #206

I always find it disheartening that people see the propagation of 'bad' information on social-media networks as a bigger risk to society than said networks becoming the gatekeepers of all propagated information. The term 'Orwellian' has become so overused that it seems to have lost all currency. When we're confronted with an actually Orwellian phenomena people seem to either not notice or not care. It's not as though…

My teen years were the second half of the 80s. Like a lot of kids my age, I’d sometimes seek out weird stuff outside of the pre-internet mainstream. One of my favorite books from back then was “High Weirdness by Mail”. Which was a very funny tongue-in-cheek catalog of crackpots, conspiracy theorists, cults, etc. I won’t detail all the weird stuff I got in the mail, but it suffices to say that most of it was roughly on the same level as Q.

But the key difference between now and then was: I had to seek this crap. Someone had to put together their zine or cassette or, very rarely, their full color glossy magazine. All at their own expense and then send it off to me. Ordinary people would never see this stuff. The mainstream culture was often bland but it was successful at gate keeping this kind of stuff. And this material was too labor intensive & expensive to distribute widely without the mainstream.

So it’s obviously very different now. People like my mom would have never sent a dollar to a post office box in Idaho to get a newsletter about how Ronald Reagan was a microchip controlled antichrist. But these days I frequently have to alleviate her fear from some conspiracy crap that popped up on her timeline unsolicited. Or to tell my aunt that there’s absolutely no evidence Biden is receiving antifa messages from a hidden earpiece.

I don’t know what the answer is. But the situation of widely broadcast misinformation utterly divorced from reality is relatively new. Having something like Q approach mainstream status is new. At least for Americans in the past 50 years. It’s a potentially very dangerous situation. Maybe one day, a vast majority of the population will discount what they read online without corroborating evidence, but we’re not there yet.

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#219

Post by intrasight »

bilg21 wrote: post #212
intrasight wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have hundreds of Facebook friends. I read their posts or add my own posts perhaps twice a day. 90% are status updates and/or photos of what they are up to. I find it extremely useful. It's a micro-blogging service. When did this moniker "social media" come into being? What does that even mean? I should say that I have everything except direct posts disabled - including all "shares" and all ads - and that's why to m…

Would you mind sharing how you've disabled ads and shares? I could not find such options in facebook settings. Only thing I can think of is adblock or writing my own software to pull feeds and filter them.

I use the F.B. Purity add-on. Can't imagine using Facebook without it.

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#220

Post by ajxs »

dragontamer wrote: post #216
ajxs wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Its an issue of disinformation, not stupidity, that's leading people down the wrong path... You're wrong. The difficulty has always been that the most pervasive so-called 'misinformation' is usually fairly plausible, difficult to validate, or simply matters of opinion or interpretation. The notion that Obama is a Muslim strains credulity, and it's not a widely held belief. What about more complex information, such…

> The notion that Obama is a Muslim strains credulity, and it's not a widely held belief. Its a held belief in my family. My very mother, my uncles, and more. Whether or not it is "widely held" has little-to-no bearing on the seriousness I take it. Since my mother believes in it, I will take the alternative fact seriously. > What disinformation? The information you don't like, or the information I don't like? Disinfo…

Did you read anything in my post? What about the widely held belief that Trump colluded with Russia to influence the 2016 Presidential election? The Meueller report was unable to prove collusion. What if big-tech suddenly banned any claims to the contrary on the grounds that it constituted 'misinformation'? Would you call that censorship then?
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