Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

51–60 of 265 posts

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#51

Post by raverbashing »

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #11
hirundo wrote: post #9

I don't trust Facebook or Twitter to distinguish disinformation from information. Why would anyone?

They can’t and they shouldn’t. The potential good that could come from this does not outweigh the catastrophic failure modes of this approach. Some enlightened people understood this, hundreds of years ago. Its time for another amendment. EDIT since this is related, another horrendous idea that recently disgraced my timeline https://twitter.com/yelp/status/1314197509623947265?s=21

> does not outweigh the catastrophic failure modes

Here's the opposite catastrophic failure mode which the enlightened free speech defenders fail to notice (or do notice but don't care because they're not the affected parties - or at least doesn't think it affects them or are simply accomplices)

Truckloads and truckloads of unchecked fabricated BS drowning the discourse. Mob censorship.

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#52

Post by bdamm »

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #11
hirundo wrote: post #9

I don't trust Facebook or Twitter to distinguish disinformation from information. Why would anyone?

They can’t and they shouldn’t. The potential good that could come from this does not outweigh the catastrophic failure modes of this approach. Some enlightened people understood this, hundreds of years ago. Its time for another amendment. EDIT since this is related, another horrendous idea that recently disgraced my timeline https://twitter.com/yelp/status/1314197509623947265?s=21

They're removing bots. I for one appreciate the lowered noise floor. If a platform (Facebook) is claiming that it's for people, then we should know when a post is from a person or a bot.

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#53

Post by JumpCrisscross »

drawkbox wrote: post #33

Repeat after me, social media is not reality. Social media is the new tabloid salacious media. Yes it can be fun, entertaining, informative and educational, it can also be propaganda, misinformation, astroturfing, and a big high school like popularity contest where people are fake and narcissistic but probably insecure. The truth is the internet is teaching the biggest lesson ever in critical thinking and getting you…

> Social media is the new tabloid salacious media

We’re living through a modern rehash of yellow journalism [1]. Both were spurned by free societies adapting to new communication technologies.

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#54

Post by root_axis »

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #11
hirundo wrote: post #9

I don't trust Facebook or Twitter to distinguish disinformation from information. Why would anyone?

They can’t and they shouldn’t. The potential good that could come from this does not outweigh the catastrophic failure modes of this approach. Some enlightened people understood this, hundreds of years ago. Its time for another amendment. EDIT since this is related, another horrendous idea that recently disgraced my timeline https://twitter.com/yelp/status/1314197509623947265?s=21

> The potential good that could come from this does not outweigh the catastrophic failure modes of this approach.

Such as?

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#55

Post by unethical_ban »

MaxBarraclough wrote: post #46
unethical_ban wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is the alternative? Think you're the smartest person on the planet, unaffected by misinformation? "Feed me the libraries worth of bullshit from the Internet, and I will sort through this free market firehose to come to a logical, evidence based conclusion", hm? Have you ever read spam ads on Craigslist, fake comments on news sites, bots on Tinder, etc? There are patterns, there are foul motives, and with their i…

> What is the alternative? Improve your informational diet first by consciously discounting whatever you read on Facebook, and second by spending less time on Facebook. > Think you're the smartest person on the planet, unaffected by misinformation? There's no need for snark. The issue being discussed is particular to these sorts of platforms. Reputable news sources still exist.

You're substituting reality for your ideal. Sure, I believe we should have public schooling teach more raw critical thinking, rhetoric and civics. But you're not going to get the existing billion people in the online world, many of whom are some combination of hotheaded or ignorant of the wicked ways of misinformation, to suddenly "improve their informational diet".

The people who are most likely to take that advice are the ones least in need of it.

I am glad Facebook and Twitter are taking what must be very careful, researched actions against clear evidence of powerful forces using social media as a tool against reality.

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#56

Post by ben_w »

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #11
hirundo wrote: post #9

I don't trust Facebook or Twitter to distinguish disinformation from information. Why would anyone?

They can’t and they shouldn’t. The potential good that could come from this does not outweigh the catastrophic failure modes of this approach. Some enlightened people understood this, hundreds of years ago. Its time for another amendment. EDIT since this is related, another horrendous idea that recently disgraced my timeline https://twitter.com/yelp/status/1314197509623947265?s=21

Don’t let the perfect be the enemy of the good. The catastrophic failure mode of doing nothing is that democracies vote to stop being democratic, and do so with deafening applause. It has happened before.

Let them fight disinformation; also require them to be open about how they are doing it so they can’t become a disinformation provider of their own — there are already enough people, left and right, who think FB et al are censoring their ‘truths’ for nefarious reasons.

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#57

Post by bilbo0s »

drawkbox wrote: post #33

Repeat after me, social media is not reality. Social media is the new tabloid salacious media. Yes it can be fun, entertaining, informative and educational, it can also be propaganda, misinformation, astroturfing, and a big high school like popularity contest where people are fake and narcissistic but probably insecure. The truth is the internet is teaching the biggest lesson ever in critical thinking and getting you…

"Let's hope that people see it as a lesson and not somewhere they can bask in their confirmation bias"

I'm not sanguine. Be honest, which would you bet on happening in the majority of cases?

I wonder sometimes if it's almost part of some fundamental psychology?

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#59

Post by glial »

unethical_ban wrote: post #55
MaxBarraclough wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What is the alternative? Improve your informational diet first by consciously discounting whatever you read on Facebook, and second by spending less time on Facebook. > Think you're the smartest person on the planet, unaffected by misinformation? There's no need for snark. The issue being discussed is particular to these sorts of platforms. Reputable news sources still exist.

You're substituting reality for your ideal. Sure, I believe we should have public schooling teach more raw critical thinking, rhetoric and civics. But you're not going to get the existing billion people in the online world, many of whom are some combination of hotheaded or ignorant of the wicked ways of misinformation, to suddenly "improve their informational diet". The people who are most likely to take that advice…

> Facebook and Twitter are taking what must be very careful, researched action

Sorry but are we talking about the same companies? What track record do they have that helps you to believe this?

Re: Facebook, Twitter dismantle global array of disinformation networks

#60

Post by thih9 »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #53
drawkbox wrote: post #33

Repeat after me, social media is not reality. Social media is the new tabloid salacious media. Yes it can be fun, entertaining, informative and educational, it can also be propaganda, misinformation, astroturfing, and a big high school like popularity contest where people are fake and narcissistic but probably insecure. The truth is the internet is teaching the biggest lesson ever in critical thinking and getting you…

> Social media is the new tabloid salacious media We’re living through a modern rehash of yellow journalism [1]. Both were spurned by free societies adapting to new communication technologies.

I see a "[1]", but I don't see anything referencing it, did you mean to add a link?

If anyone else is unfamiliar with the term, I found a wikipedia entry: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellow_journalism

Post reply on HN