Earlier quoted context omitted.
They did have their own vm and byte code but not a programming language.
Is bytecode not a language?
Yeah, so mov or iload instructions would be protected copyright if Oracle wins.
Google and Oracle's decade-long copyright battle reaches Supreme Court
261–270 of 433 posts
Re: Google and Oracle's decade-long copyright battle reaches Supreme Court
#262Earlier quoted context omitted.
In addition to the specific claims and their validity, one fact remains. Oracle bought Sun for the sole purpose of suing Google . Full stop. I used to date someone involved in the case when it was just getting started. Oracle can go pound sand.
Thing is Google were also nasty towards Sun and helped it go under quite well. In many ways this is karma but too bad there's so much externality to it.
IIRC they were going to use the reference impl of Java but Sun wanted to inject themselves and the Java brand all over Android.
Plus Sun couldn't design a decent UI to save their lives, so Android probably wouldn't have been successful if Google had allowed Sun a large role in the platform.
Re: Google and Oracle's decade-long copyright battle reaches Supreme Court
#263Re: Google and Oracle's decade-long copyright battle reaches Supreme Court
#264Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's bad for programmers everywhere. If Oracle wins, you couldn't reimplement a compatible version of anything that's not open source. You couldn't make a third-party implementation of a corporate-owned programming language without putting yourself at risk. Imagine you're a company using some Oracle database, and you want to reimplement some component of that system in order to migrate and escape their vendor lock-in…
by the by... wasn't Oracle's original product a relational database management system (RDBMS) that offered a SQL API... which was invented/copyrighted by IBM ? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SQL#History
SQL is an ISO standard, which Oracle like everyone else also pays for.
Re: Google and Oracle's decade-long copyright battle reaches Supreme Court
#265Earlier quoted context omitted.
by the by... wasn't Oracle's original product a relational database management system (RDBMS) that offered a SQL API... which was invented/copyrighted by IBM ? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SQL#History
Of course. But Oracle doesn't care one bit about anything else that's not Oracle. Though it is still to be known how many reimplemented APIs from others does Oracle have in their products
Nope, they pay for ISO which Google hasn't done for Java.
Re: Google and Oracle's decade-long copyright battle reaches Supreme Court
#266Earlier quoted context omitted.
Let us assume for a moment Oracle wins this so what? Android will become illegal and then Oracle would ask Google to do what? Pay royalties? Pay Damages? Ask all the android programmers in the world to stop using Android ? Abandon android runtime? I think what is gonna happen realistically is capitalism will take over they will settle it among themselves and share user data as a bargain probably get some royalties. T…
Nothing much? This isn't just about the Java API. This is about EVERY API. You might not be able to write a web server anymore, depending on who owns the copyright for HTTP. You didn't invent GET, PUT, and POST, you thieving copyright abuser.
Back when I was working for Nokia, the APIs were patented, this is nothing new.
Re: Google and Oracle's decade-long copyright battle reaches Supreme Court
#267Earlier quoted context omitted.
IIRC IBM was in the play as well, but yes. I guess Google didn't want to inherit all the internal late-SUN problems so they passed on a chance to own it. Now Google had to switch to an alternate strategy utilizing JetBrains for Android.
IBM withdraw their proposal shortly after coming into the buy.
IIRC SUN's revenues at that time were flat $16B, so they were in a zombie mode, likely could have survived for the next 10-20 years but the board gave up seeing all their competitors growing like crazy YoY.
Re: Google and Oracle's decade-long copyright battle reaches Supreme Court
#268Earlier quoted context omitted.
by the by... wasn't Oracle's original product a relational database management system (RDBMS) that offered a SQL API... which was invented/copyrighted by IBM ? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SQL#History
Of course. But Oracle doesn't care one bit about anything else that's not Oracle. Though it is still to be known how many reimplemented APIs from others does Oracle have in their products
Some bmc commentary on that:
Re: Google and Oracle's decade-long copyright battle reaches Supreme Court
#269Earlier quoted context omitted.
I wonder how a meaningful discussion about namespace trees and API spelling takes place at the Supreme Court considering the background of the justices.
Do you wonder the same for an abortion hearing or a sanitation case? The court system can and must decide regulations on many things they are not personally experts in, and usually does so quite successfully.
No, I don't because I'm not an expert in those fields. To be clear, I'm not suggesting that they can't understand the subject matter or that they need to be experts in it, I'm just curious about how much technical detail is communicated and how.
Re: Google and Oracle's decade-long copyright battle reaches Supreme Court
#270Earlier quoted context omitted.
Look up the names of the functions in java.lang.Math. They are exactly the names and semantics used in the libm functions. Even down to the presence of the atan2 function which computes tan¯¹(y / x). (You could also point out that JavaScript literally lifts java.lang.Math and java.util.Date into JS code as well, down to Date.getYear returning the Gregorian year - 1900).
First, this is not a 99% blatant copy. I see things on the java side that are not in the libm side, like addExact, IEEEremainder or nextDown. I see things on the libm side that are not in the java package, like fpclassify, gamma or jN. I see things that have been adapted to match java conventions, like copySign vs copysign. The Jaccard similarity index appears to be pretty far from 1, whereas it is a perfect 1 in the…
>I see things on the libm side that are not in the java package, like fpclassify, gamma or jN.
Which were added in C99, which postdates the initial release of Java.