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IPhones and 3G iPads log your location in an unencrypted file on the device

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141–150 of 196 posts

Re: IPhones and 3G iPads log your location in an unencrypted file on the device

#141
When I read this I simply had to try it out for myself and quickly plot the data. It's a nice reminder of the places I have been over the past year.

I don't mind that Apple have saved the information on the device, what I mind is that they haven't given us an option to clear the logs or to actually visualise the data directly from the phone.

Re: IPhones and 3G iPads log your location in an unencrypted file on the device

#143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've actually used that device before. It's fairly common in law enforcement and inteligence agencies, and it will take everything. Including passwords/deleted info. There is no reason for using it on a traffic stop though, that's just straight up invasion of privacy and would piss me off to no end. It's use is (and should be) for the more criminal/forensic cases.

I wonder if that device utilizes some form of "law enforcement backdoor API", a phone analog of the "lawful intercept" in networking. Because frankly I don't understand how else it could retrieve previously deleted data from the phone.

If you look at apps like BitPim, you'll see there's a standard protocol that many phones use for syncing. That protocol gives access to far more data than you might expect. If you have USB Debugging enabled in Android, the level of access is probably similar, and even if not, they can read your entire micro SD card via USB mass storage. I don't know enough about Android syncing to say whether it's possible to access contact data via USB when the phone is not in debugging mode, or whether there's a way to activate mass storage mode or Bluetooth transfers without unlocking the phone.

Re: IPhones and 3G iPads log your location in an unencrypted file on the device

#144
post #140

So after doing a quick analysis of the data on my iPhone, I've come to the conclusion that this isn't a huge issue at all. First, I'll start with the WiFi data (WifiLocation table): Among the information captured is MAC, Timestamp, and Lat/Long. I have a total of 118,640 records in my table. I did a "SELECT DISTINCT MAC FROM WifiLocation", and got... 118,640 records. This tells me that it's not "tracking my every mov…

Location tracking on iOS devices without GPS (for example an iPod touch) sometimes works without any internet connection (it nearly always works with an internet connection – WLAN access points are used to determine the approximate location), especially in urban environments (with a lot of WLAN access points). I always figured that iOS devices download location info on all the surrounding WLAN access points (maybe ev…

Yes, when you use the location services in, say, a new city then your device will download and cache the WiFi location data for a large radius around that initial lookup the next time it has an internet connection. It's pretty cool, actually.

That database isn't infinitely large, as unused location information will be removed as new location data comes in.

Re: IPhones and 3G iPads log your location in an unencrypted file on the device

#145
post #31

Someone should make an app for jailbroken phones to disable this location logging (or delete it regularly).. many would likely pay for it!

Interesting idea, although I actually like just injecting noise (add say 500nm to all of the co-ordinates or some such) which would basically corrupt the database that this was being injected into. On a more interesting note if you put '); droptable; into your file could you delete the receiving database? A whole new vector for SQL injection hacks I suspect.

According to http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2467895 it is being used to get a faster fix for Locations based applications, so doing that would remove the ability for that work.

Re: IPhones and 3G iPads log your location in an unencrypted file on the device

#146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps you could answer a question. If the phone screen is locked will this device still gather data? I assume it will.

iTunes will happily sync with your iDevice when its screen is locked, so locking is clearly no barrier.

If you plug your iOS device into another computer it won't connect to iTunes until you unlock the device. Whether that is enforced by the phone or iTunes I don't know.

Re: IPhones and 3G iPads log your location in an unencrypted file on the device

#147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Flash hole... on an iOS device?

Backups... on an iOS device? The backups are stored on your Mac/PC, which are likely to have Flash.

There is an option to encrypt backups.

Re: IPhones and 3G iPads log your location in an unencrypted file on the device

#148
post #110

I wish this wasn't presented as sinister. The fact is, that phone companies store all that data for EVERY cell phone, and it's always available to government agencies and divorce attorneys after a subpoena. All this does is raise the common man's awareness , and possibly provides an afternoon of fun looking at your travel history. If you want your iphone data secret, it prompts you to encrypt your backups when you fi…

No. Given eg the police in Michigan using devices to dump phone contents on a regular basis [1], there is an enormous difference between unencrypted data on a device just sitting there and anything requiring a subpoena. [1] http://www.mobiledia.com/news/87523.html

Elsewhere in the threads you can see that device won't work with a password-protected iPhone

Re: IPhones and 3G iPads log your location in an unencrypted file on the device

#149

So after doing a quick analysis of the data on my iPhone, I've come to the conclusion that this isn't a huge issue at all. First, I'll start with the WiFi data (WifiLocation table): Among the information captured is MAC, Timestamp, and Lat/Long. I have a total of 118,640 records in my table. I did a "SELECT DISTINCT MAC FROM WifiLocation", and got... 118,640 records. This tells me that it's not "tracking my every mov…

The problem is this data is being recorded without the user's knowledge or permission. (Unless it's a tiny line in the EULA I'm unaware of.) If the data is being used to help the performance of Location Based Services, there is no need to keep years worth of data, that persists, and is backed-up every time you sync. Apple could simply keep a log of the last 4 or 5 data points. Further, the data may not be super accur…

Unethical? Really? I don't think it is that at all. A mistake it isn't encrypted? Yes.

Re: IPhones and 3G iPads log your location in an unencrypted file on the device

#150
post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"collection of data that might conceivably expose their users' wrong-doing" So to answer his question honestly: Yes, you are implying exactly that.

No, I am not. I wrote, "Life is complicated." Turn the issue around: how would you feel if Apple bent over backwards to help your partner fuck other people behind your back and leave no trace? I don't know why I'm bothering to write this, because you seem resistant to the concept of moral subtlety, but I will anyway: Studies have been done that show that morally equivalent choices can be posed in ways that lead to pe…

I don't see where and why you find the need to make such as Shakespearian dilemma out of it. Nokia, RIM, Android, you-name-it, don't record your position with a day to day resolution. There is no need to do that. Apple does it; it does so in an almost hidden way and without apparent reason. Anyone should at the very least be quite suspicious or concerned about it while you seem to come up with a lot of ethical bullshit.
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