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Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

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Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#301
post #143

This is going to be a big mess. PayTM as a company isn’t known for respecting user privacy. The CEO’s brother was caught in a sting video saying they could sell any user’s information for a price (search online and you’ll find the video). All that these Indian startups care is for them to benefit and control everything. It’s not about equitable treatment. It’s more about regulatory capture and making sure that their…

> This is going to be a big mess. PayTM as a company isn’t known for respecting user privacy. Controversial opinion here, but this is part of the reason I like that Apple makes (practically) all purchases run through them. They don’t sell my information, and they have an incentive to not change that.

Apple also makes it easy to unsubscribe to any app's subscription. You don't have to call some number and wait on hold.

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#302
post #3

Ok maybe the Indian govt can force Android phone manufacturers to pre install it's app store, how is this going to play out on iPhones? Are we going to see a ban on iPhones in India?

Let's look at some background 1) The issue is that Google is attacking competitors using the App Store as a weapon Google Pay is one of the biggest payment apps in India It attacked PayTm, another very big payment app, by making its app disappear 2) So lots of Indian companies are using it as an opportunity to do BOTH A) Point out Google attacking competitors B) Google taking 30% cut is unsustainable * Now, in INdia…

This is annoying as shit. Lot of people use Google Pay or Amazon Pay because they are good.

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That or government will mandate the Libertarian Wild West on our phones where anyone can install anything from any store. It's a little disconcerting to me that you would see allowing me to install whatever software I want on a device I fully own as a "Libertarian wild west." > Mobile operators alone will balk at that. Why? Don't fixed-location ISPs have the same issue? > the market evolved I think the concern is i…

If the device wasn’t connected to the global telephone network then you’d have a point. Mobile carriers and governments have never allowed just “anything“ installed on phones. > I think the concern is it didn't evolve naturally.. it evolved to this configuration due to the whims of a few companies in strong monopoly positions. What’s “natural?” Markets are not created by god, they’re created by customers. Apple didn’…

> Want a better situation? Build a new and better ecosystem.

The problem is it's chicken and egg. To get users you need apps, to get app developers you need users. To overcome that you don't just need something which is as good as the status quo, you need something so much better that people will switch to it despite the apps conundrum.

Apple got there by being first to market with a modern smartphone. Google got there by undercutting the competition on price. Neither of those are a possible path for a new competitor. They can't be first to market anymore, and they can't undercut Android on price because its price is already zero.

The usual way underdog platforms avoid this is by establishing compatibility with the competitor's apps. Sun created Java so that people would write their apps in Java, which would then run on Solaris/SPARC as well as Windows/Intel. Wine allows Windows programs to run on Linux.

But that doesn't work here either, because of the very problem the new platform would be needed to solve. Even if you created a competing platform that could run Android apps or iOS apps, it wouldn't have Google or Apple's store, which is where all the existing apps are. The user of your new platform can't go to the developer's website to get the existing app and run it on your new platform because the existing platforms don't allow apps to be distributed that way. So you have to convince all the existing developers to use your store, and avoid use of Google Play Services etc., before you have any users that would give developers the incentive to spend their time doing that.

Moreover, the incumbents are vertically integrated. If I think I can make a better OS than Apple, to capture their customers I don't just need to convert all their developers, I also have to make competitive hardware. Where do I get the money to develop a CPU competitive with Apple's? I would have to be a company as big as they are to do that, or bigger to overcome the advantages of incumbency, but nobody is as big as Apple. Microsoft, which is nearly as big, tried and failed. Amazon's Fire line is just an Android fork running on commodity hardware.

Who do you propose has the resources to unseat the incumbents at this point?

> I see a lot of devs/publishers complaining and not a lot of users.

That's a big part of the problem -- the users lack visibility into the inner workings. How many iPhone customers even realize that competing stores are prohibited, or that Apple bans things they may want? They don't see the apps they want that Apple prohibits, because when they're prohibited they don't exist. When they're prohibited the developers are starved of access to their own customers and destroyed, or never exist to begin with, which means they can't campaign to the users for their inclusion.

The developers can't even show the users how much they're paying, or offer discounts for purchases made through other channels, because Apple prohibits it.

So of course it's the developers complaining, because they're the ones who can see what's happening behind the scenes. But the users are still being harmed, even if that's being hidden from them.

And the lack of user awareness is another impediment to establishing a new competing platform.

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#304
post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least we get a choice whether we want our privacy violated by CCP, silicon-NSA complex, or Indian aristocracy

What choice? All of these are mandatory.

Buy an Android One phone that provides updates, install F-Droid, use the open source maps/etc.. with minimal play store use and disable every thing else you don't need.

There clearly are choices, though at varying levels of convenience.

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#305
Although government control will lead to more problems down the line, at least, this has opened serious debate about the unfair control Apple and Google has over the App stores.

Third part app stores should be allowed, and in the end, hopefully, the best one will come out as a winner.

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#306
post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right - we currently have a quasi duopoly which frankly won’t last a decade if people are willing to compete with it. Both companies are showing signs of ossification. If governments get involved, we’ll have a government monopoly and government regulated software sales forever .

That obviously depends on which governments and what the governments do. A US antitrust ruling that Apple can't constrain the user from installing apps from competing stores while Apple is still selling the device and not loading it up with crapware by default is very different than a requirement from China or India to install the government's store as root on everybody's phone from the factory. The difference being…

Actually there is no difference.

As soon as Apple is constrained, everyone else who can impose requirements will do so.

This idea about choosing which stores you trust, is a complete fantasy. Even in the most free market of countries, you’ll end up with a small set of corporations you don’t trust as he only viable stores.

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fact of the matter is there's nothing too scary about living in China as long as you are not involved in politics. The scary thing about a BJP lead authoritarian regime is that unlike the CCP, BJP is made of a bunch of idiots. CCP is authoritarian, but they have made sure every Chinese has food on the table, a roof on their head and one can live an honest life in China without having to be corrupt. Crime rates in Chi…

The fact that the CCP are competent authoritarians and the BJP are incompetent semi-authoritarians isn't really in dispute. But the claim that there's nothing scary about living in China if you're not "involved in politics" (whatever that means) is completely absurd.

I lived there, I've also lived in India. I hate to put it this way but for practical reasons it is far safer to live in China than in India. CCP also takes the pains to make sure Children are not out on the street begging. I could go out at midnight without worrying about being lynched - to me this is a more fundamental freedom than freedom of political expression. Believe it or not China does allow their authorities to be criticized. If I wrote this comment online in China, I would not actually be censored. Yes there are topics that are considered taboo. But such topics are fairly limited.

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#308
post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

lol, yup - Muslims are the Indian bogeyman. Similar to how African Americans and Hispanics are looked at in the U.S. The value for life is non-existent in India, unfortunately.

Did 'African Americans and Hispanics' invade, plunder, rape, kill and convert the local US population at any time in History?

I thought this was hackernews not the unkill network, remember how woke people without any proof decided Muslims were getting infected on purpose to destabilize India and literally nothing happened, and people are just stupid anyway? Also do you say the same about Germany, England and Japan too? People like you is the reason India still has a caste system.

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>But what if the alternative is no app stores? Anyone can install whatever software they want on their device from wherever they want it There was already an open, accessible, free app store called - 'Internet Browser' upon which Internet was built. These companies undermined it in collusion with the duopolies to hoard more data from their customers and are now crying wolf.

Do you mean web apps? Today they are powerful, but in 2008 browsers based web apps could not have access to a lot of things native apps could, I think, so native was inevitable, hence the AppStore.

>not have access to a lot of things native apps could

That's my point here -

>in collusion with the duopolies to hoard more data from their customers

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have to explain this comment. Because it will look like politically charged content to outsiders. The following is a rough summary of Indian politics from my perspective: The current leadership has done some fishy marketing tactics for sure. There are swathes of fake news on whatsapp and Facebook which lure unsuspecting citizens into thinking the current leadership is some kind of savior. The local media is mostly…

You made some good points and then started making the same points that the extreme Hindutva trolls make - that the students are supporters of muslim fundamentals merely because they ask questions. What is the "long standing tradition" that you are referring to?

I raise my voice against any government policy, suddenly Im told to migrate to Pakistan, Im told I support muslim ideology. Don't believe me? Tweet or head to any other major subreddit other than r/india, I'm actually glad r/india hates BJP.
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