Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission • Hacker News Board

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#961

Post by krapp » Thu, Oct 01, 2020, 9:33 PM UTC

young_unixer wrote: post #873

stjohnswarts wrote: post #839

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like it or not BLM -the organization- does have some pretty leftist ideas that not everyone is fond of (Marxism for example espoused by some of the leaders of the movement). Some of them involve completely dismantling police forces as they're traditionally formed. However BLM the concept of equality for blacks and equal treatment under the law that is something 90% of the population can get behind. I think there is a…

Every political term has at least 3 layers of meaning. 1. The literal meaning of the term or its original definition. 2. The core ideas proposed by the group or by whoever defined the term. 3. The real actions of people who feel identified by a group or people who use the term. Many times we have misunderstandings because we are thinking about different layers. Also, these differences in meaning are often astutely us…

There's a fourth layer of meaning you may be overlooking - the willful misinterpretation of the term used by its opponents.

One obvious example being the use of "all lives matter" and "blue lives matter" to reinforce the false interpretation of "black lives matter" as meaning "only black lives matter," when the phrase more correctly means "black lives matter as well."

Or the way that "fake news" has been re-appropriated to refer to bias within mainstream media, rather than literally fabricated stories and memes posing as news on social media and the web.

Or ask a feminist and a redpiller to agree on what "toxic masculinity" actually means.

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#962

Post by lucaspauker » Thu, Oct 01, 2020, 9:54 PM UTC

erichocean wrote: post #957

AmericanChopper wrote: post #777

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the parent comment is just quite typical of modern political extremism. Where every actor must take a position on every issue, where failure to take the correct position is heresy, and where failure to take any position amounts to taking a position against the one of the extremist who is demanding that you take one (and is therefor also heresy). The role of an employee is to deliver value to the employer duri…

> Where every actor must take a position on every issue Not taking a position is, by default, choosing to uphold the status quo. When the status quo is unjust, it's choosing to uphold injustice. That's fine, just own up to it. Hiding behind "I'm apolitical" when you're a loyal foot soldier for the current system isn't a good look.

...point in case

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#963

Post by AmericanChopper » Thu, Oct 01, 2020, 10:14 PM UTC

erichocean wrote: post #957

AmericanChopper wrote: post #777

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the parent comment is just quite typical of modern political extremism. Where every actor must take a position on every issue, where failure to take the correct position is heresy, and where failure to take any position amounts to taking a position against the one of the extremist who is demanding that you take one (and is therefor also heresy). The role of an employee is to deliver value to the employer duri…

> Where every actor must take a position on every issue Not taking a position is, by default, choosing to uphold the status quo. When the status quo is unjust, it's choosing to uphold injustice. That's fine, just own up to it. Hiding behind "I'm apolitical" when you're a loyal foot soldier for the current system isn't a good look.

This line of reasoning falls over with even the slightest level of scrutiny. It's just a way of bullying people into adopting the political views that you want them to, and it shouldn't be tolerated in a society that values democratic freedoms. An uncountable number of injustices take place across the world every day, and any individual person will be playing no part in, and have no influence over a vast majority of them.

This argument can't be taken as honest or sincere, because with absolute surety I can guarantee that horrific injustices took place today that you have absolutely no concern about at all.

When somebody presents this argument, they are not honestly advocating for justice. What they are actually saying is that "by not adopting _my_ political views, you are acting out evil". Part of any person's political world view is how they choose the issues that they consider to be important, knowing that they only have the span of their short life, and the means of their limited resources to address the problems in the world. You have no right to demand that somebody make the same decisions in this respect as you do. It is absurd, it is hostile to the notion of free democracy, and it is a standard that no living person could ever meet.

And all of that is before you account for the fact describing something as an injustice in the first place is quintessentially an opinion. This sort of thing reminds me a lot of the psychology of warfare, where soldiers are systemically taught to view the enemy as animals who lack humanity. It has a terribly toxic influence on society. Your ideas no longer need to compete on their merits, because the people who disagree with them are the enemy, and the enemy is less than human.

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#964

Post by pm90 » Thu, Oct 01, 2020, 10:35 PM UTC

Zanneth wrote: post #952

pm90 wrote: post #901

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for posting this. I think she makes excellent points. I've worked at companies where similar executive retaliation to principled employees has happened before, and I can relate to the changes that seem to have been instituted (pre-vetting town hall questions to execs, shutting down slack channels that allow for asking questions to execs directly). Funnily enough, I interviewed at Coinbase not that long ago, an…

“Draconian” is a bit of a strong word, don’t you think? Coinbase isn’t prohibiting employees from doing activism in their free time.

I think that term described pretty well what he's instituted.

> Definition of draconian

> 1 law : of, relating to, or characteristic of Draco or the severe code of laws held to have been framed by him > 2 : cruel also : severe

from https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/draconian

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#965

Post by fakedang » Thu, Oct 01, 2020, 10:55 PM UTC

blaser-waffle wrote: post #941

stateofnounion wrote: post #536

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They're just poison. This. And like another commenter pointed out, it's not unique to one side or the other. Anyone who defines their entire existence in this left/right dichotomy is suffering from media-induced mental illness.

Pepsi and Coke only want you to think about Pepsi and Coke, because it means they only compete against 1 rival, instead of Fanta, Sprite, RC Cola, Faygo, etc.

I think Coke wouldn't mind us thinking about Sprite, as Pepsi doesn't mind us thinking about Fanta.

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#966

Post by MFLoon » Fri, Oct 02, 2020, 12:55 AM UTC

erichocean wrote: post #957

AmericanChopper wrote: post #777

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the parent comment is just quite typical of modern political extremism. Where every actor must take a position on every issue, where failure to take the correct position is heresy, and where failure to take any position amounts to taking a position against the one of the extremist who is demanding that you take one (and is therefor also heresy). The role of an employee is to deliver value to the employer duri…

> Where every actor must take a position on every issue Not taking a position is, by default, choosing to uphold the status quo. When the status quo is unjust, it's choosing to uphold injustice. That's fine, just own up to it. Hiding behind "I'm apolitical" when you're a loyal foot soldier for the current system isn't a good look.

I used to be baffled at the use of "SJW" as a pejorative, but comments like this reveal it's aptness to me. It's not the fighting for justice that's negative, it's the adoption of the warrior mentality. Which, ironically, is a perfect reflection of the problem with American policing - viewing the world as a battlefield and anyone not with you as against you. There are no non-combatants in the streets, just as there are none in the ideological trenches. The struggle for order and/or social justice is a totalizing endeavor that demands complete obedience, to the point where non-compliance/apolitical intransigence is treated more harshly than some forms of law-breaking/ideological deviance.

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#967

Post by exclusiv » Fri, Oct 02, 2020, 1:30 AM UTC

AmericanChopper wrote: post #963

erichocean wrote: post #957

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Where every actor must take a position on every issue Not taking a position is, by default, choosing to uphold the status quo. When the status quo is unjust, it's choosing to uphold injustice. That's fine, just own up to it. Hiding behind "I'm apolitical" when you're a loyal foot soldier for the current system isn't a good look.

This line of reasoning falls over with even the slightest level of scrutiny. It's just a way of bullying people into adopting the political views that you want them to, and it shouldn't be tolerated in a society that values democratic freedoms. An uncountable number of injustices take place across the world every day, and any individual person will be playing no part in, and have no influence over a vast majority of…

> It's just a way of bullying people into adopting the political views that you want them to, and it shouldn't be tolerated in a society that values democratic freedoms.

> You have no right to demand that somebody make the same decisions in this respect as you do. It is absurd, it is hostile to the notion of free democracy, and it is a standard that no living person could ever meet.

Well said. It's sad that activists are anti-liberty in this way. It undermines their campaigns.

I had a professor in college tell an entire class the first day - "nobody really cares about you except your family and maybe some friends". You could see the shock to a lot of the students who had been coddled and told how awesome they were their whole life. Once you accept that concept, you can learn to be more effective in communication and not expect things from others.

Most of these activists have no tact.

Neil deGrasse Tyson says in his MasterClass that his father taught him that it's not enough to be right. You must be effective.

The world would be a much better place if everyone followed that.

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#968

Post by muzika » Fri, Oct 02, 2020, 1:39 AM UTC

Would be great if liberal tech companies could give similar benefits to whoever wants to leave because their political views don’t align with the company’s views. I don’t talk about politics at my workspace because I know only one side is welcome there.

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#969

Post by muzika » Fri, Oct 02, 2020, 1:44 AM UTC

skinkestek wrote: post #485

nrmitchi wrote: post #390

I know that this will greatly help a few who are legitimately disturbed by the recent post and feel they either can't work at, or aren't excited by, Coinbase any more. But at the level of severance discussed in the post (4 (or 6) months, 7-year exercise window), it feels like most employees who know they could soft-land into another position would be silly not to take this offer. Some people may still enjoy working a…

At this point in my life this is a message that would make me want to stay. Not having to deal with activism at work sounds like a nice perk!

For sure! I would much rather work at a politically neutral company.

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#970

Post by muzika » Fri, Oct 02, 2020, 1:54 AM UTC

dannyr wrote: post #188

pornel wrote: post #56

This is going to work great for Coinbase. It's very helpful for employers to select for conformists who can be told to shut up, and not stand up for what they believe (unless they believe in the status quo and the company, which is called non-political). Selecting for groupthink^W mission is pretty important in the business of cryptocurrencies. Reduces chances of anyone having a different moral stance that would push…

So Coinbase would not have open discussion of ideas, employees would hesitate to question managerial decisions. It would be amazing for a company to succeed with that culture.

Quite the opposite. It opens up discussions without the pressure to be on only one specific side. I don’t ever talk about politics in my workplace because my views clearly do not align with those of our management.