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Suicide Linux (2009)

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Re: Suicide Linux (2009)

#101

Post by ColanR »

ojnabieoot wrote: post #82
ColanR wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I read it, the comment sounded like the emphasis was on stereotypes of the culture, not the gender. Maybe you're reading too much into it.

To be clear: comments about "polite" Japanese versus "strict" Germans and "angry" Italians are also bigoted and will make many immigrant coworkers deeply uncomfortable (especially if they are women). Everything about his comment is gross and 100% inappropriate for the workplace, and civilized society in general.

> comments about "polite" Japanese versus "strict" Germans and "angry" Italians are also bigoted

As the other commenter mentioned, "bigoted" implies "intolerant". A joke about culture differences isn't intolerant of those cultures; you're just overreacting.

And as someone else mentioned, the Japanese, Germans and Italians do not want or need you to save them. Maybe you should dial it back a bit.

Re: Suicide Linux (2009)

#102

Post by chuckSu »

ojnabieoot wrote: post #82
ColanR wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I read it, the comment sounded like the emphasis was on stereotypes of the culture, not the gender. Maybe you're reading too much into it.

To be clear: comments about "polite" Japanese versus "strict" Germans and "angry" Italians are also bigoted and will make many immigrant coworkers deeply uncomfortable (especially if they are women). Everything about his comment is gross and 100% inappropriate for the workplace, and civilized society in general.

I think you just need a glass of “Get the f... over yourself”. You’ll be okay

Re: Suicide Linux (2009)

#104

Post by quesera »

bashinator wrote: post #49
dkarl wrote: post #27

> Perhaps rm -rf / should be replaced with something with more verbose flags set. That way, when you run a bad command, you are told immediately that things are being deleted This gives me an idea: Hell Linux. In Hell Linux, the operating system does its best to pretend that nothing is wrong, so it takes you as long as possible to realize that you've made a mistake. Commands ignore all unrecognized flags. In shell sc…

> In shell scripts, if one branch exits with a nonzero exit code, the other branch is taken. > 0 exit code is reported for all processes, no matter how they terminate. These two things are mutually exclusive - shell script branching is usually based off of exit codes.

I read that, and I thought that.

But then I decided that the GP was probably throwing out suggestions, not developing an internally-consistent model for the final design. :)

Re: Suicide Linux (2009)

#105

Post by laksdjfkasljdf »

wincy wrote: post #30
dkarl wrote: post #27

> Perhaps rm -rf / should be replaced with something with more verbose flags set. That way, when you run a bad command, you are told immediately that things are being deleted This gives me an idea: Hell Linux. In Hell Linux, the operating system does its best to pretend that nothing is wrong, so it takes you as long as possible to realize that you've made a mistake. Commands ignore all unrecognized flags. In shell sc…

This sounds like if the designers of the web made a Linux distro.

This is already what happens.

Just like the web (W3C?) was a front for microsoft taking over from Netscape, and now Google taking over from everyone else, the linux foundation et al are just fronts for Google et al to have whatever they want on the kernel and to prevent any and all GPL3 "corruption" of their take-take-take business practices.

GNU/Linux is old news, everyone runs BIGCORP/Linux today. You probably have more code from Google/Amazon/etc than GNU in any modern distro.

Just look at all the effort devoted to systemd (which is a blatant copy of oracle/windows service management) or everyone eating up the hype of zsh on macs (which is nothing but a spin from apple: Look how this new shell is so much better, oh bash is going to be GPLv3, no this has nothing to do with it, look how shiny is zsh!)

GPLv3 will set you free!

Re: Suicide Linux (2009)

#106

Post by quesera »

YooLi wrote: post #99

Should be called Landmine Linux as most times, suicide is not accidental whereas stepping on a Landmine usually is. Entertaining project none-the-less. Thanks.

That is a better name in all ways.

It might upset people who live in former war zones though. I can't speculate there.

Re: Suicide Linux (2009)

#107

Post by tremon »

ojnabieoot wrote: post #65
jmnicolas wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the operating system does its best to pretend that nothing is wrong, so it takes you as long as possible to realize that you've made a mistake. You're describing my (modest) experience with Javascript: it fails silently. I was describing it this way to a colleague: Javascript is a Japanese girlfriend, too polite to show you your mistakes so you have a hard time to know what you did wrong. I want a rigorous German g…

I am from the left-liberal side of things, including my choice of employers, and I am always flummoxed when I come into HN and see developers a) make comments that are flagrantly bigoted and misogynistic b) indicate that they make comments like these to their colleagues Do devs really say horrible things like this at the workplace? If anyone on my team made jokes about Japanese vs. Italian girlfriends, either they wo…

I too am from the left-liberal side of things, and I am always flummoxed when I see people on HN immediately generalizing every misstep they see to all developers, and only to developers. Why should developers be holier than the average population?

But as for question, yes, we do say those things here. But I'm from the European mainland, and we do enjoy stereotyping each other. That has nothing to do with racism or bigotry, but with acknowledging and celebrating differences. I'm reminded of a comic that I came across around the time of the introduction of the Euro, and I saved it because I thoroughly enjoyed it: https://imgur.com/a/SmdkRLZ

So please, do not assume malice whenever someone points out cultural differences. Humor can be a connecting force, not just a dividing one.

Re: Suicide Linux (2009)

#108

Post by jlokier »

fantod wrote: post #100
ojnabieoot wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be clear: comments about "polite" Japanese versus "strict" Germans and "angry" Italians are also bigoted and will make many immigrant coworkers deeply uncomfortable (especially if they are women). Everything about his comment is gross and 100% inappropriate for the workplace, and civilized society in general.

Have you actually met a person from Europe? They play on stereotypes constantly.

> They play on stereotypes constantly.

Above is true. But below is also true:

> make many immigrant coworkers deeply uncomfortable (especially if they are women)

You can also add gay people, trans, etc - and even things like being smart, or stupid, or being a man or woman, or blond or redhead or... etc - to the list who have to endure feeling uncomfortable and unwelcome (and often keeping it to themselves or playing along) in a workplace where "they" are made fun of regularly.

I think it's because humour and oppression both exist, and actual for real consequences of the latter have been very severe and sometimes still are. It's hard to tell how much of each is really in process at any moment, so of course it's uncomfortable, and of course if someone feels they have to fit in to keep in their colleague's good books at work, they'll tend to keep their discomfort and background to themselves.

Re: Suicide Linux (2009)

#109

Post by dllthomas »

bashinator wrote: post #49
dkarl wrote: post #27

> Perhaps rm -rf / should be replaced with something with more verbose flags set. That way, when you run a bad command, you are told immediately that things are being deleted This gives me an idea: Hell Linux. In Hell Linux, the operating system does its best to pretend that nothing is wrong, so it takes you as long as possible to realize that you've made a mistake. Commands ignore all unrecognized flags. In shell sc…

> In shell scripts, if one branch exits with a nonzero exit code, the other branch is taken. > 0 exit code is reported for all processes, no matter how they terminate. These two things are mutually exclusive - shell script branching is usually based off of exit codes.

Not quite mutually exclusive, I think. The combination just means we always try the "true" path first, in our depth-first search of paths out of the script.

Re: Suicide Linux (2009)

#110

Post by yjftsjthsd-h »

dkarl wrote: post #27

> Perhaps rm -rf / should be replaced with something with more verbose flags set. That way, when you run a bad command, you are told immediately that things are being deleted This gives me an idea: Hell Linux. In Hell Linux, the operating system does its best to pretend that nothing is wrong, so it takes you as long as possible to realize that you've made a mistake. Commands ignore all unrecognized flags. In shell sc…

I've actually wished for something that takes it the other direction: Technically, everything it does is allowed, but it's designed to stress-test your assumptions. So, a distro that replaces half of coreutils with busybox, the other half with toybox or BSD ports or something, the system libc is musl, build tools are patched to randomly switch between using gcc or clang (both of which have `-Werror` enabled by default), user home directories are created like `/home/First Last/` (and if it doesn't have a last name for you it'll just leave a trailing space in the name), mktemp likewise is patched to stick temporary files somewhere other than `/tmp` by default (and always somewhere with a space in the name), /bin/sh is provided by dash (this isn't super rare, but some stuff still assumes that BASH is /bin/sh), normal programs are all in PATH but /usr/bin is empty (or maybe chmodded 000 or something)...

The idea is, if your code builds and works on this system, it'll run anywhere, correctly, because the system leaves no room for "oh, everybody does it this way, so it's fine to rely on this non-standard behavior".

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