Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission • Hacker News Board

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#891

Post by andy_ppp » Thu, Oct 01, 2020, 6:08 AM UTC

sieabahlpark wrote: post #604

andy_ppp wrote: post #434

I am caught in two minds on this, I’m personally extremely political, but I want to clearly understand both sides of arguments as deeply as I possibly can. For example I often argue things in my own mind from a conservative, let’s keep everything stable, work hard, individual responsibility POV even though I firmly believe probably 80% of people’s success is down to luck and consequently think a strong welfare state…

> I firmly believe probably 80% of people’s success is down to luck and consequently think a strong welfare state and 99% inheritance tax is the correct way to run things. So you think wealth is based on 80% luck and your solution is to reset the family wealth every time? So a family who isn't "lucky" can't pass on their little wealth to their children and have that compound over time? You'd prefer the children get t…

I would say 99% maybe 100% above maybe ten million dollars or so, sure. Why do you think hereditary wealth is positive? Maybe everyone would have to improve society and try to make sure the bottom of it isn’t quite so horrendous as it is now. But I understand where you’re coming from, there’s nothing like working hard and doing well to make you think the money is yours not something you are lent largely by being born in the right place, at the right time, with the right parents etc. etc.

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#892

Post by xvector » Thu, Oct 01, 2020, 6:13 AM UTC

newobj wrote: post #653

itsoktocry wrote: post #589

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What makes you so sure you're on the "right" side here?

You ever wonder why "politics at work" has flared up so much in the last 4 years? Have you completely lost sight of the timeline of events, or do you refuse to acknowledge it? Do you think it's a reaction to something? Or did it just spontaneously instigate itself one day? Just uppity libs getting bored? People are speaking up because people feel existentially threatened. Because people are being existentially threat…

But that’s just the thing. Whether you feel like you’re being attacked or not is irrelevant. It’s not something your coworkers or company should have to deal with, so long as the attacks are not instigated in the workplace.

And I strongly disagree that most people arguing politics at work feel “existentially threatened.” No, most people that argue politics at work do it because it is a topic that is interesting and quick to generate vigorous (counterproductive) discussion (and division).

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#893

Post by ponker » Thu, Oct 01, 2020, 6:15 AM UTC

If Coinbase is going to be completely apolitical are they permissive of any political activity outside of the office? If a Coinbase employee goes to a white supremacist rally with a tiki torch, and posts it on their personal Facebook visible to other Coinbase employees, are those employees forbidden to discuss it at work? Is this considered permitted behavior at Coinbase?

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#894

Post by xvector » Thu, Oct 01, 2020, 6:18 AM UTC

cmsonger wrote: post #275

I understand the points of praise, but let me offer a counter argument. Companies have an obligation to defend the system that provided the environment in which they were formed and flourished. This election is a bit different than normal. I've never seen a sitting president that would not commit to the peaceful transfer of power. You really think that coinbase would be where it is if we had that for the last 50 year…

> Companies have an obligation to defend the system that provided the environment in which they were formed and flourished.

No, the only thing companies are obligated to do is what they want to do (usually profit), within the boundaries of the law.

There’s no obligation to support the environment in which you flourished. A particularly ruthless company might actively work against that environment to prevent competitors. And it’d be fine - use the law to define what a company can or cannot do instead of depending on personal (company) responsibility.

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#895

Post by xvector » Thu, Oct 01, 2020, 6:23 AM UTC

andy_ppp wrote: post #891

sieabahlpark wrote: post #604

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I firmly believe probably 80% of people’s success is down to luck and consequently think a strong welfare state and 99% inheritance tax is the correct way to run things. So you think wealth is based on 80% luck and your solution is to reset the family wealth every time? So a family who isn't "lucky" can't pass on their little wealth to their children and have that compound over time? You'd prefer the children get t…

I would say 99% maybe 100% above maybe ten million dollars or so, sure. Why do you think hereditary wealth is positive? Maybe everyone would have to improve society and try to make sure the bottom of it isn’t quite so horrendous as it is now. But I understand where you’re coming from, there’s nothing like working hard and doing well to make you think the money is yours not something you are lent largely by being born…

> Why do you think hereditary wealth is positive?

Because I have the right to provide for my children and ensure they can live their best life.

I don’t care if it’s “not fair” or if I “lucked out.” My family comes in first. Not the government, not anyone else - if I make something or earn something, it is my right to provide for my family.

> largely by being born in the right place, at the right time, with the right parents etc. etc.

Why is anyone obligated to a level playing field?

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#896

Post by pm90 » Thu, Oct 01, 2020, 6:48 AM UTC

siculars wrote: post #876

kats wrote: post #736

Two weeks the same CEO campaigned against Apple's App Store policies on Twitter, and totally made it out to be a moral issue when it benefitted him. https://mobile.twitter.com/brian_armstrong/status/1304490208... "There are many unbanked and underbanked people in the world who have no ability to get a loan to buy a home, or start a business, so this kind of technology has enormous potential to improve the world over…

He was kind of very up front about being solely focused on economic freedom. Coinbase’s mission is to create an open financial system for the world. This means we want to use cryptocurrency to bring economic freedom to people all over the world. This is squarely in line in trying to push Apple to be more amenable on this issue.

I don't think the OP is arguing the merits of the argument. The OP is pointing out the hypocrisy in the founder using political tactics to pressure another entity into complying with his principles, while prohibiting his employees from doing the same. Disguising the latter under a "no politics at work" principle seems hypocritical when the founder himself is engaging in politics at work.

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#897

Post by andy_ppp » Thu, Oct 01, 2020, 6:49 AM UTC

xvector wrote: post #895

andy_ppp wrote: post #891

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would say 99% maybe 100% above maybe ten million dollars or so, sure. Why do you think hereditary wealth is positive? Maybe everyone would have to improve society and try to make sure the bottom of it isn’t quite so horrendous as it is now. But I understand where you’re coming from, there’s nothing like working hard and doing well to make you think the money is yours not something you are lent largely by being born…

> Why do you think hereditary wealth is positive? Because I have the right to provide for my children and ensure they can live their best life. I don’t care if it’s “not fair” or if I “lucked out.” My family comes in first. Not the government, not anyone else - if I make something or earn something, it is my right to provide for my family. > largely by being born in the right place, at the right time, with the right…

You just think you have that right, but really it’s an opinion you hold strongly. My opinion is different from yours on this, and I certainly don’t think we’re about to persuade each other here.

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#898

Post by dang » Thu, Oct 01, 2020, 6:52 AM UTC

johnyzee wrote: post #669

hackerfromthefu wrote: post #591

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The pagination also breaks comment deep links that aren't on the first page - ie deep links to a comment after a 'more'

Sorry for the meta hijacking, but now that we're here, HN developers: Please penalize comments that jump the queue by responding to the top comment. There are frequently topics with hundreds of comments, where almost all are replies to the first comment, or the first comment of that comment, ad inifinitum. Reddit does it right by auto-folding comment trees once they reach a certain depth vs. upvotes.

We regularly detach replies to the top comment that aren't really replies to the top comment. But of course we can't do that in every thread.

> Reddit does it right by auto-folding comment trees

That doesn't address the "faux replies to top comment" problem unless you auto-fold at depth 1 (i.e. collapse away all replies to every top-level comment) – which feels like too much auto-folding to me.

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#899

Post by pm90 » Thu, Oct 01, 2020, 6:54 AM UTC

young_unixer wrote: post #747

human_person wrote: post #565

Erica Joy (Director of eng at Github) had an interesting take on this. https://twitter.com/EricaJoy/status/1311178025275289600 "coinbase engineers walked off [in June] because brian wouldn't say "Black Lives Matter," he posted it so they'd get back to work, now he's having an executive "YOU AREN'T THE BOSS OF ME!" meltdown* about it" and "this looks a whole lot like the play certain advisors tell CEO's to run when th…

That speaks much worse about herself than it does about Coinbase.

Why does it speak worse of her?

Re: Coinbase offers exit package for employees not comfortable with its mission

#900

Post by mjburgess » Thu, Oct 01, 2020, 6:55 AM UTC

pm90 wrote: post #896

siculars wrote: post #876

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He was kind of very up front about being solely focused on economic freedom. Coinbase’s mission is to create an open financial system for the world. This means we want to use cryptocurrency to bring economic freedom to people all over the world. This is squarely in line in trying to push Apple to be more amenable on this issue.

I don't think the OP is arguing the merits of the argument. The OP is pointing out the hypocrisy in the founder using political tactics to pressure another entity into complying with his principles, while prohibiting his employees from doing the same. Disguising the latter under a "no politics at work" principle seems hypocritical when the founder himself is engaging in politics at work.

It isnt hypocrisy. Employees are not prohibited from working and campaigning on the company mission.