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Cheerleading, Monopolies and Sexual Predators

mattstoller.substack.com

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Re: Cheerleading, Monopolies and Sexual Predators

#41

Post by pow_pp_-1_v »

starkred wrote: post #29
jjoonathan wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't cancel a monopoly, so the monopoly doesn't have to care. It's not a conflation, it's a direct manifestation of their power.

Serious question: if there were competing companies involved in Cheerleading - Varsity vs. Nike or something - do you think sexual predators goes away? I have trouble believing that.

If there are competing companies then the governing bodies will hopefully not be beholden to one company. So the governing bodies will have an incentive to keep the sport safe. Else if the sport suffers then it affects the governing bodies too.

If the governing body is beholden to a company, then the company's priorities (money) will be what the they care about. Which I think is what happened here.

Re: Cheerleading, Monopolies and Sexual Predators

#43

Post by dragonwriter »

starkred wrote: post #29
jjoonathan wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't cancel a monopoly, so the monopoly doesn't have to care. It's not a conflation, it's a direct manifestation of their power.

Serious question: if there were competing companies involved in Cheerleading - Varsity vs. Nike or something - do you think sexual predators goes away? I have trouble believing that.

> Serious question: if there were competing companies involved in Cheerleading - Varsity vs. Nike or something - do you think sexual predators goes away?

I think that it’s likely that a field which wasn't a monopoly would more rapidly evolve better systems for dealing with reports than a monopoly, in part because the discussions between participants on the other side and the industry would be more likely to be open discussions about industry-wide arrangements rather than confidential one-on-one negotiations, and in part because failing to deal with them would be a potential short-term competitive benefit (avoiding a narrow scandal) that would have long-term competitive adverse consequences (the greater scandal of more abuse plus neglect and coverup.)

But without competition, the pressure to deal with problems is less, until the consequences become existential even in the absence of competition, which requires them to get extremely bad (cf, USA Gymnastics.)

Re: Cheerleading, Monopolies and Sexual Predators

#44

Post by just-juan-post »

takbw4234 wrote: post #4

Daily reminder that any young female-driven competitive venture (fashion, sports, academics, acting in the movie industry) is filled to the brim with sexual predators: coaches, judges, trainers, consultants, marketers, agents and so on. Do not ever put your daughter in a situation where she can be pressured by older men to do what they want in order to advance. She doesn't need a gold medal or be world famous, she ne…

> Do not ever put your daughter in a situation where she can be pressured by older men to do what they want in order to advance. She doesn't need a gold medal or be world famous, she needs not to be raped

No school. No work. No going to stores because you know the nasty shopkeep might be tempted to give her a discount for a blowjob.

Which nunnery will you be putting your child in?

Re: Cheerleading, Monopolies and Sexual Predators

#45

Post by blackbear_ »

starkred wrote: post #27
takbw4234 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The solution (...) [i]s to fix the cultural acceptance of sexually predatory behavior toward women No, sorry, you're taking the wrong angle here. There's no wide ranging cultural acceptance of sexually predatory behavior, that's why they're called sexual predators and not sex-positive mentors. And they're attracted like flies to shit to positions of power in these kind of institutions. Please do shelter the victims…

> There's no wide ranging cultural acceptance of sexually predatory behavior There is as long as the solution is "keep women away from sexual predators" instead of "keep sexual predators away from women". Keeping girls away from competitive sports is yet another example of "boys will be boys".

Nice word play, but what is a practical, pragmatic solution to achieve that?

Re: Cheerleading, Monopolies and Sexual Predators

#46

Post by jacobwg »

watwut wrote: post #39
jacobwg wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with what you're saying on all points, but there's a different parallel discussion around safety and situational awareness that I believe the OP was referring to. Essentially, sexual predators looking to abuse children will go wherever the children are, be that schools, churches, athletics, social media, online games, and so on. Additionally, certain situations have power dynamics weighted heavily in the dire…

Situational awareness the way you described it means a girl must avoid ambitions and competitive situation. The issue with "properly handle them if they arise" is that ability to properly handle things strongly depends on whether complains are taken seriously (ideally long before it all escalates to high abuse) or not.

> Situational awareness [...] means a girl must avoid ambitions and competitive situation...

That's one judgement call to make, but not the only one. There are lots of different factors that could affect any given situation, but certain situations are safer than others, and there are ways to increase or decrease the safety of many given activities.

> [the] ability to properly handle things strongly depends on whether complains are taken seriously...

This is huge, and is actually a good example of how a parent might increase the safety of a situation - parents that are involved in their children's lives, are aware of what's going on, and, critically, believe their children if they communicate that something is uncomfortable or anything happened go a long way towards both deterrence and handling things that do happen. Child abusers generally gravitate towards opportunity, so obstacles in the way of that opportunity like an aware parent decrease the likelihood that abuse will happen with that child.

There's a ton of systemic problems with complaints being taken seriously though, in society at large, in institutions, and with all people, not just children.

Re: Cheerleading, Monopolies and Sexual Predators

#47

Post by Chris2048 »

starkred wrote: post #17

> I don’t know how much Varsity was involved here, but I suspect, at the very least, that Varsity execs were turning a blind eye to what was happening. As far as I can tell this is the sum up of his assertion that Varsity is responsible for sexual predators in cheerleading. Everything else is about Varsity having a monopoly on cheerleading and monopolies are bad - both of which are arguably true but I think dodges th…

while I see the theme, I also think there are smaller aspect that need to be addressed: such as a "regulator" having a monopoly on insurance, tied to one supplier, creating an explicit conflict of interest.

I also think the the courts allowing large interests to bully smaller individuals, such as the lawsuit against a non-sanctioned competition, needs to be addressed. Either Varsity is a gatekeeper, or it isn't - if it isn't, how could it possibly have a say in what competitions a gym competes in.

A monopoly is maybe "what", but these other violations are "how".

Re: Cheerleading, Monopolies and Sexual Predators

#48

Post by starkred »

takbw4234 wrote: post #38
starkred wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you seriously suggesting that we keep our daughters out of fashion, academics, sports, and movies as that is the only way to keep them from being raped? > Do not ever put your daughter in a situation where she can be pressured by older men to do what they want in order to advance Are you also suggesting that we don't let her work at a FAANG company? Many of us are 'pressured' by older men to advance, if you exten…

> Are you seriously suggesting that we keep our daughters out of fashion, academics, sports, and movies as that is the only way to keep them from being raped? I'm suggesting you should outright tell them that it's very likely that at some point some guy will try to demand sex from her and strongly suggest that she should GTFO and call you and/or the police asap in that case. She will not only be protecting herself bu…

> I'm suggesting you should outright tell them that it's very likely that at some point some guy will try to demand sex from her

If I had heard that growing up I would have avoided men under any and all circumstances. Since I am posting here, you might imagine what a detrimental effect that would have had on my life.

Seriously, all you are going to teach young women is that the world is a terrifying place and they should hide themselves from it. I don't think you can imagine how awful that advice is. I easily can.

Re my last statement. If you told everyone of either gender that they should avoid situations where they have to rely on older men for their advancement, no one would have any job.

Re: Cheerleading, Monopolies and Sexual Predators

#49

Post by Chris2048 »

falcolas wrote: post #32
starkred wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Serious question: if there were competing companies involved in Cheerleading - Varsity vs. Nike or something - do you think sexual predators goes away? I have trouble believing that.

If one of the competitors cared to address the issue, yeah, it would have gone down. When there's a choice, there's (more) incentive to address things that will give you bad press.

And if neither wanted to handle that hot potato, you'd have 2 corps supressing the issue.

Re: Cheerleading, Monopolies and Sexual Predators

#50

Post by starkred »

takbw4234 wrote: post #38
starkred wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you seriously suggesting that we keep our daughters out of fashion, academics, sports, and movies as that is the only way to keep them from being raped? > Do not ever put your daughter in a situation where she can be pressured by older men to do what they want in order to advance Are you also suggesting that we don't let her work at a FAANG company? Many of us are 'pressured' by older men to advance, if you exten…

> Are you seriously suggesting that we keep our daughters out of fashion, academics, sports, and movies as that is the only way to keep them from being raped? I'm suggesting you should outright tell them that it's very likely that at some point some guy will try to demand sex from her and strongly suggest that she should GTFO and call you and/or the police asap in that case. She will not only be protecting herself bu…

> Tell her it's OK to work somewhere else if the only way to get there is to fuck the interviewer

Tell her that if that happens then she is strong enough to report it until something is done about it. Don't give in to bullies.

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