Want to attract top tech talent? Offer telecommuting • Hacker News Board

Re: Want to attract top tech talent? Offer telecommuting

#51

Post by jordanb » Tue, Apr 19, 2011, 6:46 PM UTC

I routinely have people begging me to work for them, but probably 4 in 5 clam up when I specify that -- while I'm happy to spend as much time with them as necessary to get the specs and make everyone comfortable -- I will not sit in their office to do the programming.

I can not, for the life of me, understand why that is such a sticking point with so many people. Fortunately I have enough people who are willing to work with me anyway that I can forget about the ones who don't, but it seems mind-numbingly obvious to me that if you're desperate for the skills I have, you should be willing to work with a requirement that doesn't cost you anything.

As near as I can fathom, it's a psychological thing. Remote people don't seem like they're part of your "empire" as you look out across the office and see all the busy beavers hunched over their computers.

Re: Want to attract top tech talent? Offer telecommuting

#52

Post by Vivtek » Tue, Apr 19, 2011, 6:46 PM UTC

Vivtek wrote: post #48

bphogan wrote: post #14

I would love to do more remote work, but then I hear horror stories about people having problems not being around people. Feelings of isolation set in after a couple of months, and people end up going to a gig where they are around people. To those doing remote work, is this common?

I've worked at home since 1996 and there is no way in hell you'd drag me back. I never had a problem with isolation, but then I have kids. Isolation for me is a goal, not a fear. In this, as in all things, your mileage will certainly vary. If you're a type-A people person, you should probably stick with a social context. Although (as elsewhere noted) you'd be surprised how much social interaction you can have online…

Oh - the other variable - I grew up on a farm miles from anywhere, so I'm used to spending time by myself. That's probably also a factor.

Re: Want to attract top tech talent? Offer telecommuting

#53

Post by lancefisher » Tue, Apr 19, 2011, 6:47 PM UTC

I live in Missoula, MT and I'm not willing to move because my family is here, and I love the city. Programmers here are willing to take a pay cut to stay, and I know several that telecommute to out of state jobs that pay better than most local companies. I telecommute too, but my employer is local.

Re: Want to attract top tech talent? Offer telecommuting

#54

Post by tsewlliw » Tue, Apr 19, 2011, 6:49 PM UTC

eru wrote: post #40

mgkimsal wrote: post #4

This is sort of a no-brainer. I'm pitched by recruiters about once a week, and they're all for far away positions - typically SF area, but other areas too. I can't sell my house any time soon - the market just isn't moving - so I'm somewhat held hostage by geography. This doesn't mean that I can't travel onsite and visit your office regularly, nor does it mean skype and phone don't work out here in the sticks :) Tele…

Why can't you sell your house? Your house has already decreased in value, not accounting for the loss in your books doesn't make it more valuable.

Like many things, the value of your home is only loosely tied to it's market value. It's also expensive to move across the country, and more expensive emotionally to leave your friends behind.

Re: Want to attract top tech talent? Offer telecommuting

#55

Post by igorgue » Tue, Apr 19, 2011, 6:53 PM UTC

My advice would be, talent /= experience.

I'm sick and tired of companies being super picky because I don't know their technology stack or maybe just one element, they don't even offer a technical test these days.

I wont learn Cassandra or Scala because they are popular on super-webscale sites, I did, though, learn Haskell, Node, MongoDB, Redis, Python, Ruby, not because they teach that in college. I think that tells you I can learn other technologies.

But I get a feeling - in many interviews I've had in the last couple of month - they get disappointed when I tell them I don't know Scala, Cassandra, Hadoop...

Most good programmers I know (they're not genius level, nor most of the people here) are willing to relocate wherever you are, but they might not know the super-awesome-webscale technologies you use because they work for actual businesses that charge customers and don't need a billion uniques a month to be profitable.

Instead of bitching about the lack of talent (and there are many programmers like me) be willing to train people on your weird-ass technology stack.

Re: Want to attract top tech talent? Offer telecommuting

#56

Post by orangecat » Tue, Apr 19, 2011, 6:53 PM UTC

Vivtek wrote: post #44

ddlatham wrote: post #33

I see several comments saying more companies should be hiring remote workers, building their culture to support it, and why aren't they doing it? It's interesting to see the numbers in this article. What's remarkable is that, even after two years of flattish compensation, technology professionals are willing to sacrifice $7,800 on average to work from home The article speaks as if this is a huge amount, but as a chun…

That's not a huge amount. Say you have a mere half-hour commute = 1 hour a day x 250 working days a year, your $7800 turns into $31.20 an hour for the most boring work you'll ever do - even a truck driver usually gets to see different scenery from day to day. And that's if you manage to live a mere half-hour from work, which in any major city is seriously unlikely. If you're good at tech, why would you take a second…

Exactly. One of the few clear-cut results of happiness studies is that commuting really, really sucks. I can understand why telecommuting might not work for some companies, but there's rarely an excuse for not offering flexible hours, so you can at least dodge rush hour by coming in earlier or later.

Re: Want to attract top tech talent? Offer telecommuting

#57

Post by mgarfias » Tue, Apr 19, 2011, 6:55 PM UTC

bphogan wrote: post #14

I would love to do more remote work, but then I hear horror stories about people having problems not being around people. Feelings of isolation set in after a couple of months, and people end up going to a gig where they are around people. To those doing remote work, is this common?

I've been telecommuting for almost six years now and the thought of going back to an office is terrifying. I would end spending 2+ hours in traffic, be separated from the things that matter to me most (wife, 2yro, two German shepherds) that also provide a bit of refresher when things aren't going well. Good luck playing ball with your dog in an office.

Having been at an all-telecommute shop i can say that we ended up doing far more work than most teams. 10pm email conversations with the CEO were normal.

Re: Want to attract top tech talent? Offer telecommuting

#58

Post by mgarfias » Tue, Apr 19, 2011, 6:55 PM UTC

bphogan wrote: post #14

I would love to do more remote work, but then I hear horror stories about people having problems not being around people. Feelings of isolation set in after a couple of months, and people end up going to a gig where they are around people. To those doing remote work, is this common?

I've been telecommuting for almost six years now and the thought of going back to an office is terrifying. I would end spending 2+ hours in traffic, be separated from the things that matter to me most (wife, 2yro, two German shepherds) that also provide a bit of refresher when things aren't going well. Good luck playing ball with your dog in an office.

Having been at an all-telecommute shop i can say that we ended up doing far more work than most teams. 10pm email conversations with the CEO were normal.

Re: Want to attract top tech talent? Offer telecommuting

#59

Post by praptak » Tue, Apr 19, 2011, 7:02 PM UTC

pbj wrote: post #43

I was reading a study a while back about how an absurdly high percentage of total jobs could be done via telecommute but aren't. It's crazy to think about how many millions upon millions of dollars in fuel costs and reduced emissions could be saved by having more telecommuters. Not only that, but companies could save so much money by having reduced or no office space/electricity/etc. Plus they'd get the added benefit…

What you said, plus the employee commute time - I have actually turned down a (nominally) better paid job offer to accept a (nominally) lower one. The pay is lower, but the almost instant commute means I actually earn more per (work + commute) hour. On top of that I also save on fuel, car wear and tear and road jam frustration.

Re: Want to attract top tech talent? Offer telecommuting

#60

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Apr 19, 2011, 7:08 PM UTC

Vivtek wrote: post #44

ddlatham wrote: post #33

I see several comments saying more companies should be hiring remote workers, building their culture to support it, and why aren't they doing it? It's interesting to see the numbers in this article. What's remarkable is that, even after two years of flattish compensation, technology professionals are willing to sacrifice $7,800 on average to work from home The article speaks as if this is a huge amount, but as a chun…

That's not a huge amount. Say you have a mere half-hour commute = 1 hour a day x 250 working days a year, your $7800 turns into $31.20 an hour for the most boring work you'll ever do - even a truck driver usually gets to see different scenery from day to day. And that's if you manage to live a mere half-hour from work, which in any major city is seriously unlikely. If you're good at tech, why would you take a second…

[deleted]