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Abuse isn’t an “advising style”: Consequences of MIT sheltering abusive mentors

blog.usejournal.com

21–30 of 148 posts

Re: Abuse isn’t an “advising style”: Consequences of MIT sheltering abusive mentors

#21

MIT is FAR from the only offender here, so much so that I find it odd to be calling MIT out in particular. And abuse takes a lot of forms. My advisor once went eighteen months without ever laying eyes on one of his doctoral students.

Yes, that's right. An MIT grad student should perform a study across all universities to get a representative sample before writing a blog post about his experiences. This is the only acceptable thing. He is not permitted to share what happened to him.

Re: Abuse isn’t an “advising style”: Consequences of MIT sheltering abusive mentors

#22

MIT is FAR from the only offender here, so much so that I find it odd to be calling MIT out in particular. And abuse takes a lot of forms. My advisor once went eighteen months without ever laying eyes on one of his doctoral students.

caltech

Re: Abuse isn’t an “advising style”: Consequences of MIT sheltering abusive mentors

#23

Unsolicited advice for any potential PhD students choosing between schools/advisors: you should try very hard to talk to current PhD students, preferably in person or at least over the phone or video call (at any rate, not in writing). Try to talk to as many as possible. Good advisors will probably have a few students who will speak up for them, and great advisors almost certainly will. In contrast, bad advisors will…

Another bit of advice, see if the lab has had any suicides in recent memory.

Also, if one or more occurs, gtfo before the stress gets you.

Re: Abuse isn’t an “advising style”: Consequences of MIT sheltering abusive mentors

#24
post #13

Fair warning: you _never_ get the full picture if you only hear one side of it. It is possible that the advisor is a manipulative asshole (though it's unlikely that they are to such an extent), or it is possible that the author grew up always getting participation trophies and now isn't getting any (far more likely, IMO). So before you render your judgment, wait for at least some semblance of corroboration.

> it is possible that the author grew up always getting participation trophies and now isn't getting any (far more likely, IMO)

Why do you think it's "far more likely" that the student is the problem?

Re: Abuse isn’t an “advising style”: Consequences of MIT sheltering abusive mentors

#25
The same happens at other high profile universities and with bad managers at companies like Google. The organization seeks to protect itself, the same way that institutions handle paedophiles: pretend the problem doesn't exist, move the perpetrator elsewhere, and blame the victim.

Re: Abuse isn’t an “advising style”: Consequences of MIT sheltering abusive mentors

#26
post #13

Fair warning: you _never_ get the full picture if you only hear one side of it. It is possible that the advisor is a manipulative asshole (though it's unlikely that they are to such an extent), or it is possible that the author grew up always getting participation trophies and now isn't getting any (far more likely, IMO). So before you render your judgment, wait for at least some semblance of corroboration.

> it is possible that the author grew up always getting participation trophies and now isn't getting any (far more likely, IMO) Why do you think it's "far more likely" that the student is the problem?

Because you don't get to stick around if you abuse people to the extent described in the article. At least I haven't seen it, in a quarter century of my adult life. I quite frequently see folks who treat any demands that they do what they've signed up to do as "abuse" though.

Think about it: say you are a judge and you wanted to _really_ understand why someone is divorcing their spouse. Would you listen to just one spouse or both?

Re: Abuse isn’t an “advising style”: Consequences of MIT sheltering abusive mentors

#27

MIT is FAR from the only offender here, so much so that I find it odd to be calling MIT out in particular. And abuse takes a lot of forms. My advisor once went eighteen months without ever laying eyes on one of his doctoral students.

I’ll second that - I went to a decent uni (in EU) and while I escaped a lot of the negativity a few very close colleagues of mine in an almost identical lab went through years of hell at the same institution. It totally could have been me in their position if my focus had been just slightly different. It was kinda just was luck I ended up where I did.

I think about it a lot and how I’m sure a lot of brilliant people are not able to fulfill their potential due to these issues.

Re: Abuse isn’t an “advising style”: Consequences of MIT sheltering abusive mentors

#28

MIT is FAR from the only offender here, so much so that I find it odd to be calling MIT out in particular. And abuse takes a lot of forms. My advisor once went eighteen months without ever laying eyes on one of his doctoral students.

I went to a SUNY school. My advisor kept me waiting 20 minutes after outside of his office for an appointment made a week earlier, only to walk out with coat on, announcing that he was going to happy hour. He suggested that i set up another the following week through the department secretary. I walked over to do that, discovering that he was actually going to happy hour at the airport, and from there India, and would…

Sounds like you dodged a bullet there. Imagine if you were successful in registering.

Re: Abuse isn’t an “advising style”: Consequences of MIT sheltering abusive mentors

#29
"Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely" - Lord Acton

The underlying issue is the huge power differential between advisers and students. Whenever there is such a power differential, abuse is almost inevitable.

I fear that unless that power differential gets addressed, any solutions are going to just be superficial band-aids on a festering wound.

Re: Abuse isn’t an “advising style”: Consequences of MIT sheltering abusive mentors

#30
This is very very common. As long as professors publish, they can get away with a lot of things, bonus points of the students are indentured to their H1B. I've seen Ph.D students in their 30s, mother of children, cry in front of me because of the abusive and neglectful actions of their advisors. They essentially run their lab as a personal fiefdom, and HR is powerless in this situation. Sexual harrassment cases are moth-balled, meanwhile the school prints tons of material talking about gender-equality, etc.
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