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Re: Won’t Subscribe

#281

Post by runxel »

boplicity wrote: post #280

It's clear that there is one problem that the article is trying to solve. The irony, of course, is that it is not a problem for newspapers, it's a problem for the author of the article. The author wants to read articles they don't have access to, and they don't want to pay what publishers are charging. That's the problem. Newspapers regularly create things worth reading. People want to read those things. They don't w…

> Sorry, but suggesting difficult and complex business models does not help newspapers.

And neither do their current digital business models. (Ok, maybe it's different in the US, but it for sure doesn't work over here in Europe)

Re: Won’t Subscribe

#282

Post by runxel »

boplicity wrote: post #19

As a long-time publisher, there is only one primary metric that matters to me: loyal readers. I don't publish for the occasional visitor. I publish for the loyal readers that I have worked hard to cultivate, engage, and enrichen. The primary work is one of building a relationship with a loyal readership, based on consistency and quality. Our websites, as they're designed, are probably a little annoying to people who…

This certain attitude is why the publishers are dying. But hey, keep going! Godspeed and I like to see you burn.

Re: Won’t Subscribe

#283

Post by JulianMorrison »

Spivak wrote: post #232
JulianMorrison wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given that the implementation seems to be "constant drain of money per time open" then reading it twice costs twice, and the only way to read at your leisure without throwing away money is to paste the text into Notepad.

I expect a browser extension to emerge immediately that transparently clones pages and views them locally.

That won't necessarily help if there's still a "bleed money to XYZ" HTML tag in there.

Re: Won’t Subscribe

#284

Post by marcus_holmes »

pjc50 wrote: post #188
marcus_holmes wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good question :) I guess he's writing an opinion column though? I don't read the Torygraph so I haven't read his column. Opinion columns, as always, are not journalism.

> Opinion columns, as always, are not journalism ... I don't think this is a widely held view, and they're both big money makers and very popular.

> I don't think this is a widely held view,

Outside journalism, possibly. Inside journalism, opinion columns are definitely not journalism. Which is why they are clearly marked "opinion".

They're held to different standards, basically because it's clearly labelled as "just someone's opinion" - there's no need to fact-check, provide balance, or even quote sources.

Re: Won’t Subscribe

#285

Post by jwr »

boplicity wrote: post #19

As a long-time publisher, there is only one primary metric that matters to me: loyal readers. I don't publish for the occasional visitor. I publish for the loyal readers that I have worked hard to cultivate, engage, and enrichen. The primary work is one of building a relationship with a loyal readership, based on consistency and quality. Our websites, as they're designed, are probably a little annoying to people who…

> I don't publish for the occasional visitor.

I think that's a perfectly fine approach, and I understand it.

Now, could we please have filters in HN that would allow me to hide all the submissions that link to articles that are not published for the occasional visitor?

I am very serious — I am in a similar situation to Tim Bray, where I subscribe to a number of publications and have no intention of subscribing to anything else. The links pointing to paywalled articles have zero value for me. I understand they have value for subscribers of these publications, but HN is wider in scope.

Re: Won’t Subscribe

#286

Post by psadri »

virgilp wrote: post #277
boplicity wrote: post #19

As a long-time publisher, there is only one primary metric that matters to me: loyal readers. I don't publish for the occasional visitor. I publish for the loyal readers that I have worked hard to cultivate, engage, and enrichen. The primary work is one of building a relationship with a loyal readership, based on consistency and quality. Our websites, as they're designed, are probably a little annoying to people who…

Here's the thing: with this model, it's (somewhat) easy to keep loyal readers, but it's maybe hard to get new ones. I think this is the part that you're not disclosing here - how do you get new readers? A lot of times, a business like yours relies on the referrals from the loyal customers in order to expand. If you make it impossible for the "occasional reader" to read you, then by extension you make it extremely dif…

One could allocate each loyal subscriber a limited number of trial passes to share with their friends. The passes would allow them to access one or a few articles for a limited time.

Re: Won’t Subscribe

#289

Post by criddell »

nicoburns wrote: post #193
mnky9800n wrote: post #133

What's strange is it used to be you would pick up a newspaper at a stand for the day, pay a dollar or whatever, and then have quite a lot of articles to read for that day. But now, it is impossible, the only way is to lock-in. And that may be for the rest of your life if the complaints about the labirynth you may navigate to unsubscribe the nytimes is to be believed. If there was some sort of daily access pass that d…

Newspapers used to make most of their money from adverts. Facebook/Google have stolen all that revenue which is why the media companies have all been struggling to find new business models.

Don't forget Craigslist. Classified ads used to be the major source of revenue for a lot of smaller papers.

Re: Won’t Subscribe

#290

Post by cthalupa »

sjy wrote: post #223
mlthoughts2018 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least for newspapers this model can’t work. When considered as a civic function to ensure unbiased access to facts and emerging critical stories, your approach is completely at odds with consumers, even loyal customers. The reason is that the market signals emitted by loyal readers don’t have any relationship to objective reality. Loyal readers might disbelieve evolution and only respond to articles that favor cre…

Doesn’t the existence of “loyal readers” imply that the publication approach is not “at odds with consumers”? If we can’t trust consumers to emit the correct market signals then we should not rely on them to voluntarily fund important civic functions.

Not really. It doesn't imply much of anything as stated.

You could still have loyal customers even if your model is generally anti-consumer.

Without knowing any details about the business, it's impossible to determine if he's a successful publisher, or if the publications are generally low overhead so they can stay afloat with a relatively small set of customers, etc.

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