Meantime mothers in the USA get 12 weeks, below the minimum recommended by the WHO (16 weeks).
French fathers will now get 28 days of paternity leave
181–190 of 485 posts
Re: French fathers will now get 28 days of paternity leave
#182Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Honestly for the vast majority of births the father is unnecessary to be there after two weeks. The child spends the first month basically eating and sleeping. I took 3 months off for my first and 4 months for the second. My wife was pretty miserable through the first month. Breastfeeding is exhausting, as well as being woke up at various time of the night. I'm glad I was home so I could take care of the rest. I ag…
Frankly that sounds like your partner had problems with depression. Not everyone's experience is the same but requiring 3 months full time care by two adults for a toddler is not the norm.
He never stated that 3 months were necessary. Only the first month was mentioned.
Beside that recovery from birth itself can take quite some time (tearing, C-section etc.).
Beside that I wonder if a post-partum depression might even be considered a normal complication when around 15 out of 100 women get one(https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5941764/).
Re: French fathers will now get 28 days of paternity leave
#18328 days? That's barely enough to get your head off from work tbh. I just finished 133 days (at 80% pay) of paternity leave here in Norway, and the last part was def more rewarding than the start as you hit your new stride and regular work life grew ever more distant. All the organised toddler activities shut down because of covid19. Bought one of those child carrier backpacks, and we've been exploring forests and mou…
This is at the beginning equivalent to the two weeks omsorgspermisjon you should have got after the birth (but which legally doesn't have to be paid).
Re: French fathers will now get 28 days of paternity leave
#184Compare this to 480 days of shared and paid parental leave in Sweden at 80% salary. The fathers are looked at negatively if the don’t take some of this time. https://www.businessinsider.com/sweden-maternity-leave-pater...
I dont understand how this could be a viable strategy -- unless your job is entirely useless, the business must replace your position during your absence in order to continue normal operation; even thirty days absence should disrupt things, if an alternative isn't found.. So then what exactly do you return to? It can't be your old position exactly -- you were replaced. So its more like a vague promise that the busine…
I think it's quite healthy for the business TBH. In Scandinavia this is the norm, at a medium sized company there will probably always be someone on parental leave at any given time. You expect it, and therefor deal with it by reducing the bus factor up front.
Re: French fathers will now get 28 days of paternity leave
#185Earlier quoted context omitted.
I dont understand how this could be a viable strategy -- unless your job is entirely useless, the business must replace your position during your absence in order to continue normal operation; even thirty days absence should disrupt things, if an alternative isn't found.. So then what exactly do you return to? It can't be your old position exactly -- you were replaced. So its more like a vague promise that the busine…
Since it's normal, companies adapt and it isn't really an issue at all. I've never seen anyone in my jobs (IT) that have been "replaced" in any way shape or form.
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Re: French fathers will now get 28 days of paternity leave
#186Compare this to 480 days of shared and paid parental leave in Sweden at 80% salary. The fathers are looked at negatively if the don’t take some of this time. https://www.businessinsider.com/sweden-maternity-leave-pater...
I dont understand how this could be a viable strategy -- unless your job is entirely useless, the business must replace your position during your absence in order to continue normal operation; even thirty days absence should disrupt things, if an alternative isn't found.. So then what exactly do you return to? It can't be your old position exactly -- you were replaced. So its more like a vague promise that the busine…
> I dont understand how this could be a viable strategy -- unless your job is entirely useless, the business must replace your position during your absence in order to continue normal operation
Just because you cannot get fired for going on parental leave does not mean that the company cannot hire a substitute for your absence. This is typically what happens.
Re: French fathers will now get 28 days of paternity leave
#187Earlier quoted context omitted.
"Unfortunately, it's hard to force men to take their leave" There's no reason to force anyone to do this. The statement is dystopian. If you offer it to people, and they legit don't want to take it, anything beyond that you're the problem, not the solution.
I have worked in law and tech. I have seen many men who took hardly any time off in law firms because it was heavily frowned upon. In tech, it is much less frowned upon, as evidenced by the fact that many big tech companies offer the same leave to fathers as mothers. I believe the reason for the different behavior is not that lawyer dads don't care about their kids/wives as much as techie dads. Rather, I believe it i…
In The Netherlands a similar law was put in effect in July 2020. I'll reap the benefits of this very soon (my partner is due tomorrow). I don't believe its fully paid though (IIRC 70%). Before this it was two days. TWO days!
This is our second child, and from the first one I know I still had lack of sleep the first 48 hours. The first week is the roughest (especially for two autistic parents an absolute hell with lack of sleep plus all kind of new stimuli), with the following months almost as severe. I believe it is incredibly woman unfriendly (I'd even call it misogynist) to give men no time from work.
On the father and mother this leads to less fatigue, burn-out, and on long-term better output. For the child, I believe its difficult to see the effect on this on short-term. For example, the effect of father-child bonding might not be seen on the short-term, and its also no guarantee, so you'd end up with some kind of correlation in a study. Proving a causation on this is going to be difficult.
Re: French fathers will now get 28 days of paternity leave
#18828 days? That's barely enough to get your head off from work tbh. I just finished 133 days (at 80% pay) of paternity leave here in Norway, and the last part was def more rewarding than the start as you hit your new stride and regular work life grew ever more distant. All the organised toddler activities shut down because of covid19. Bought one of those child carrier backpacks, and we've been exploring forests and mou…
Indeed. In Norway fathers and mothers must each take 15 weeks. And then in total there are either 49 weeks (with 100% pay) or 59 weeks (with 80% pay), so you can divide the remaining weeks between the two.
But there are some inequalities in the system still. For instance, the father can only take the shared weeks if the mother is in "activity" (working or studying). While in Sweden there is no such requirements.
And I am not sure what happens with the father's share if the mother is out of work and ineligible for proper ompensation. In that case the mother gets a one-time, approx €10 000, compensation, but I think the father does not get anything except two weeks off in connection with birth.
Re: French fathers will now get 28 days of paternity leave
#18928 days? That's barely enough to get your head off from work tbh. I just finished 133 days (at 80% pay) of paternity leave here in Norway, and the last part was def more rewarding than the start as you hit your new stride and regular work life grew ever more distant. All the organised toddler activities shut down because of covid19. Bought one of those child carrier backpacks, and we've been exploring forests and mou…
While I agree your situation sounds better, I had zero days (and due to work being shitty, barely saw my son for the first 3 months), so I'd call it a successful start.
The OP won't have seen much of their child's first 3 months either. Their time with their child probably started when the child was 8 months old and lasted until the child was about 12 months old...
Re: French fathers will now get 28 days of paternity leave
#190It really irked me that here in Canada the options were generally skewed towards mothers remaining home. You can split 40 weeks of parental leave, but many employers won't provide parental benefits and those that do often only provide parental benefits to mothers. For instance, my employer at the time provided wage top-up for women on leave but nothing for men. Just one of _many_ structually sexist policies in societ…
As a Swede the replies you get to this reasonable comment is like being sent back to the ~1970. The only thing that's "biological" is that women usually take the first months of parental leave and the father the second (and sometimes they overlap).
There's nothing whatsoever that's reasonable, and certainly not biological, about limiting that second period for the father.