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The Era of Visual Studio Code

blog.robenkleene.com

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Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#661

Post by renewiltord »

varispeed wrote: post #546
renewiltord wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, I think you're right about performance being a problem, but I have 64 GiB and a 4790k and an NVMe SSD. It's like half a percentage of my pre-tax income and was even less when I bought it. I don't need efficiency. I need something that, given fuel, gives me power. And as someone who has donated to vim, was an early backer of neovim's bountysource, and loves his terminal: vim is my ion drive, IntelliJ and friends…

I am running it most of the time with i7-8750H and also 64G or ram, plus a rather fast NVMe drive. Performance in comparison with VSCode is just bad. That being said I am using all JetBrain products (I have a license for all of them), because simply there is nothing better for my use case. But I wish they put some effort in optimising their code.

Sorry to hear that. Is that a mobile processor? Perhaps you're throttling. I boost RAM on my IntelliJ quite high (I give it like 8 gigs plus a gig each for each of the tools - Maven, Gradle, etc.). Your setup looks better than mine except for the fact that its mobile.

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#662

Post by aschatten »

fiddlerwoaroof wrote: post #453
aschatten wrote: post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(disclaimer: I am an IntelliJ fanboy) > From my experience out of the box you get poor performance and you have to spend a lot of time figuring out how to change configuration to improve it as knowledge is scattered in many places and not always up to date. I don't know if you are talking about IntelliJ or VCS, but IntelliJ can quickly start an empty project. And you don't to spend time to figure out how things work.…

I know this is how a lot of people think of the text editor/IDE divide, but it’s just not true anymore: for specific languages like Clojure or Common Lisp, emacs has plugins that provide all the essential features of an IDE with minimal fuss. For JavaScript, VSCode or tide-mode for emacs have, in my experience, significantly better code intelligence than WebStorm. The only languages IntelliJ is better at than the com…

> emacs has plugins that provide all the essential features of an IDE with minimal fuss

I vehemently disagree. There is no such thing as minimal fuss in emacs, especially when it comes down essential IDE features.

> for specific languages like Clojure or Common Lisp

Common Lisp is esoteric language at this point, not relevant here, IMO.

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#663

Post by dragonwriter »

thebigspacefuck wrote: post #640
andrewstuart wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd be more interested in VSCode if Microsoft's strategy was to relentlessly implement the most popular plugins into VSCode natively such that the most commonly used and needed functions were built in and did not require plugins. The problem with systems that are really just frameworks for other to build on is they become reluctant to build stuff that plugins exist for. The philosophy becomes to depend on the plugins…

It’s pretty easy though. You open a Python file, it asks if you want Python plug-in installed. Then you’re pretty much done except specifying your virtualenv. If you have linter settings it will ask if you want the linter installed. The big thing with Jetbrains is the cost. PyCharm is $9-$25/month and VSCode is free

> If you have linter settings it will ask if you want the linter installed.

And then, despite automatically identifying the local python venv, install the linter elsewhere so it doesn't work.

But it integrates it wonderfully when you install the linter yourself, or if you use the bundled pylance.

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#664

Post by thrashh »

slightwinder wrote: post #573
willbw wrote: post #198

I find this post along with the comments in "A Picture of Java in 2020" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24551390 to be incongruous with my experience as a professional developer. My first couple of years writing software I used Vim, then VSCode, then worked in a Java shop and was forced to use IntelliJ. I didn't like it at first, but now after a couple of years I cannot see how I lived without it. The idea that…

> The idea that VSCode is the future doesn't seem right to me. VS Code is the future of editors, not IDEs or all developing. There will always this two sides which live from the box and those who build their own box. And for the later VS Code is nowadays one of the best road to walk. > JetBrains products allow you to do so much out of the box, It's also very limited on where you can work with it. It works for the han…

Then you install the plugin for Markdown, rst or PlantUML into IntelliJ?

????

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#665

Post by thrashh »

headcanon wrote: post #257
willbw wrote: post #198

I find this post along with the comments in "A Picture of Java in 2020" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24551390 to be incongruous with my experience as a professional developer. My first couple of years writing software I used Vim, then VSCode, then worked in a Java shop and was forced to use IntelliJ. I didn't like it at first, but now after a couple of years I cannot see how I lived without it. The idea that…

Other replies have expanded on this quite a bit, so I'll just add my 2 cents: When using a strongly typed, object-oriented language like Java or C#, Jetbrains tooling, namely the intellisense and refactoring is well-worth the cost. However I'll still spin up VSCode for most all other languages since the tooling advantage diminishes when using a loosely-typed language like JS or Python. Also consider that VSCode is fr…

I use refactoring and IntelliSense for Python and JS pretty often and while it’s not as good as for Java, I find that it works pretty well.

Granted when we write code, we keep in mind whether an IDE will be able to refactor it later.

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#666

Post by pirocks »

slightwinder wrote: post #573
willbw wrote: post #198

I find this post along with the comments in "A Picture of Java in 2020" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24551390 to be incongruous with my experience as a professional developer. My first couple of years writing software I used Vim, then VSCode, then worked in a Java shop and was forced to use IntelliJ. I didn't like it at first, but now after a couple of years I cannot see how I lived without it. The idea that…

> The idea that VSCode is the future doesn't seem right to me. VS Code is the future of editors, not IDEs or all developing. There will always this two sides which live from the box and those who build their own box. And for the later VS Code is nowadays one of the best road to walk. > JetBrains products allow you to do so much out of the box, It's also very limited on where you can work with it. It works for the han…

Just wanted to let you know that all those file types have support. Markdown and rst via the official markdown plugin, and plantuml via a free(in both senses of the word) third part plugin.

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#667

Post by dheera »

tomc1985 wrote: post #390
dragonwriter wrote: post #375

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yeah but "Hello World" in actual java is a main class and a quick write to stdout, like most any other normal (programming, not scripting) language. Scripting languages are programming languages, and a class with a method is only typical of a narrow class of languages (most of which that aren't Java are specifically designed to closely follow Java); leaving aside those programming languages typically called “script…

My point was that Java's hello world is comparable to most other language, and that hello world in Android is a poor example

Well here's GTK hello world in freaking C. One file that you can gcc and run "./a.out". Not 79 files with a build system that breaks every time you hit "upgrade", and which requires me to install gigabytes worth of SDK API bloat and agree to 10 different license agreements. Want a free build system that works for this for every version of Linux in the past decade and probably the coming decade? All you need is ONE "Makefile" and you're done.

https://developer.gnome.org/gtk3/stable/gtk-getting-started....

Any higher level language and ecosystem than C should be less verbose and less involved than this. Otherwise, what's the point of being higher level?

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#668

Post by andrekandre »

nightowl_games wrote: post #334
varispeed wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From my experience out of the box you get poor performance and you have to spend a lot of time figuring out how to change configuration to improve it as knowledge is scattered in many places and not always up to date. Then it still likes to stall from time to time or sometimes doesn't register key presses properly. It's a poor user experience, but even worse is that alternatives are often worse. I wish there was an e…

JetBrains products _are_ pretty much the best. I think Android Studio + Kotlin is the best, most impressive IDE experience I've ever had. Mostly because Android Development in general is kinda hard, and Android Studio cleans it all up so nicely for you. It really outshines XCode in this regard. I've never used CLion but I really want to. That being said, I think it's clear that VSCode is, and will remain, dominant. F…

> I've never used CLion but I really want to.

its definitely great for rust and pretty good for swift development too (imo ^^)

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#669

Post by renox »

nightowl_games wrote: post #334
varispeed wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From my experience out of the box you get poor performance and you have to spend a lot of time figuring out how to change configuration to improve it as knowledge is scattered in many places and not always up to date. Then it still likes to stall from time to time or sometimes doesn't register key presses properly. It's a poor user experience, but even worse is that alternatives are often worse. I wish there was an e…

JetBrains products _are_ pretty much the best. I think Android Studio + Kotlin is the best, most impressive IDE experience I've ever had. Mostly because Android Development in general is kinda hard, and Android Studio cleans it all up so nicely for you. It really outshines XCode in this regard. I've never used CLion but I really want to. That being said, I think it's clear that VSCode is, and will remain, dominant. F…

> I've never used CLion but I really want to.

Well, it has the best indexing of C++ I've seen but it's also the slowest IDE I've used (I've stopped using it when it froze showing a blank page for many minutes when I was compiling, since then it has improved, it no longer do this, but it's still very slow).

What's 'funny' is that all C++ IDE suck: CLion is awfully slow, VSCode likes to use >29GB of resident RAM if you let it open too long (no Vim isn't an IDE, it's a text editor which you can use to build an IDE yourself..) its indexing is quite bad most of the time, and also slow (enough that when I double click on something to get to the definition, I usually have the time to find/grep the source and open it myself before it has displayed the target :-()

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#670

Post by kexx »

willbw wrote: post #198

I find this post along with the comments in "A Picture of Java in 2020" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24551390 to be incongruous with my experience as a professional developer. My first couple of years writing software I used Vim, then VSCode, then worked in a Java shop and was forced to use IntelliJ. I didn't like it at first, but now after a couple of years I cannot see how I lived without it. The idea that…

The IntelliJ story ends when they ask $300 a year, with no other option.
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