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Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

calpaterson.com

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Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#881

Post by doc_gunthrop »

lordgrenville wrote: post #289
akerro wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's a quote from the CEO saying that they looked at the market and felt like they were being underpaid. afair AMD CEO is paid 4x less than Mozilla CEO.

That is shocking if true, but doesn't seem to be? AMD's Lisa Su was the highest-paid CEO of a company in the S&P 500 last year. Su earned a total of $58.5 million in 2019 [0] Mitchell Baker, Mozilla's top executive, was paid $2.4m in 2018 [1] [0] https://edition.cnn.com/2020/06/01/tech/lisa-su-amd-highest-... [1] http://calpaterson.com/mozilla.html

Can you even compare Mitchell Baker to Lisa Su in terms of achievement?

Su revived a company on the verge of bankruptcy. Since she was appointed CEO, AMD's stock has soared and they've made themselves a viable competitor against Intel. This has been a massive boon to the market.

It's worth noting that Su has a deep understanding of the underlying technology that the company works on (she's an electrical engineer), which was essential to her success at the company.

Su is an example of merit-based compensation. Baker is not.

Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#882

Post by patrec »

ksec wrote: post #577
patrec wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you see any realistic chance of this happening? Generally if a company is captured by a parasitic leadership sucking it dry, that's it, right? Is there anyone on the board whose interests are more aligned with keeping Mozilla alive (probably hard to do at this point) than feasting on it whilst there is still something left to feast on? Presumably you'd need a few such people.

While I definitely agree with changing leadership. I dont think she can be described as parasitic leadership. She is incompetent, but I dont think she has the intention to drive Mozilla to the ground. After all she co-founded the Mozilla Project, and was the Chairwoman for a long time, long before she was named the CEO. Why did they not find someone else to be CEO is beyond me though.

I really don't really see how her actions can be interpreted in any other light. If she were just incompetent, she would not so blatantly enrich herself all the while laying off hundreds of staff, many undoubtedly more deserving. Did you read their revolting PR statement?

Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#883

Post by kelnos »

sambe wrote: post #408
Jonnax wrote: post #13

There's a quote from the CEO saying that they looked at the market and felt like they were being underpaid. And they can't reduce their salary now because it'd be unfair on their families. Firefox has a problem. It gets most of its revenue from Google. They need a different revenue stream but their ideas haven't worked. Their executives are clearly failures. But with such high pay, they're cashing out. Buying themsel…

The claim was not that they can't reduce but that an 80% discount was too much to ask of people (and thus also their families). I don't think anyone at any pay level would be happy being paid 20% of similar roles. Perhaps the problem was putting people in these roles in the first place that would accept 20% of market rate. Raising their pay subsequently doesn't make them better at their job! The quote is not really c…

Perhaps they should find someone skilled who is willing to take that 80% discount from market.

Baker has clearly not been worth her increased salary; I don't even think she's worth the original 20%-of-market salary, given how Firefox's market share has dropped precipitously, and Mozilla has been forced to lay off staff.

Sure, you're probably not going to get a 100%-of-market-rate CEO for a 20%-of-market-rate salary, for CEOs who only care about compensation. But I think that's ok, especially given that some CEOs aren't even worth 20%. And you're much more likely to get someone who actually cares about the mission.

Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#884

Post by TrackerFF »

martin_a wrote: post #72
enriquto wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And they can't reduce their salary now because it'd be unfair on their families. This kind of bullshit infuriates me to no end.

How can you even spend around 2.5 million A YEAR (okay, before taxes, whatever) if you're not BURNING the cash? I don't get it.

It's called lifestyle creep.

You go from a $1 million dollar home, to a $10 million dollar home.

Instead of one $50k car, you now own 2-3 $150k cars.

Tens of thousands of dollars will go towards your kids education, every single year.

You hire people to do work for you (tutors, nannies, maids, whatever), these cost tens of thousands of dollars.

Maybe you buy some vacation property - that's more money to spend.

And, in the end, you're not some kind of high-rolling baller that jet sets around the world in a private jet or yacht, spending fortunes on vanity.

You're really "just" living the very upper-middle class life.

Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#885

Post by gok »

staticassertion wrote: post #819
sambe wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The claim was not that they can't reduce but that an 80% discount was too much to ask of people (and thus also their families). I don't think anyone at any pay level would be happy being paid 20% of similar roles. Perhaps the problem was putting people in these roles in the first place that would accept 20% of market rate. Raising their pay subsequently doesn't make them better at their job! The quote is not really c…

I took a major financial hit to be a CEO, and as a CEO I feel personally responsible for the company's success. My compensation is primarily in ownership and stock - I would never take a massive pay raise if my company were failing, let alone repeated massive raises over years of company downturn. And then to wipe out a massive portion of your employee base? I find it abhorrent, personally.

> My compensation is primarily in ownership and stock

This would be impossible for Mozilla's structure

Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#886

Post by kelnos »

enriquto wrote: post #39
Jonnax wrote: post #13

There's a quote from the CEO saying that they looked at the market and felt like they were being underpaid. And they can't reduce their salary now because it'd be unfair on their families. Firefox has a problem. It gets most of its revenue from Google. They need a different revenue stream but their ideas haven't worked. Their executives are clearly failures. But with such high pay, they're cashing out. Buying themsel…

> And they can't reduce their salary now because it'd be unfair on their families. This kind of bullshit infuriates me to no end.

Seriously. The only reason they can say that is because they're in charge of the company and get to make decisions. How fair have Mozilla's layoffs been on the families of the laid-off workers? I bet not all that fair.

Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#887

Post by kelnos »

bogwog wrote: post #700
bronson wrote: post #650

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“That's too big a discount to ask people and their families to commit to.“ Doesn’t seem to be much of a misquote. Poor Mitchell Baker. She’ll just have to suffer with her non-discounted salary.

I'm not defending her argument or agreeing with it, I just think that the rest of the quote adds important context. Quoting that last sentence alone almost makes it seem like the bad excuse a child would make. Her actual point is that asking executives to take an 80% pay cut to go work at Mozilla is going to make it difficult to attract talented people, not that lowering the current compensation would cause the curre…

Given that she is barely even worth the lower, 80%-discounted salary, I don't find that a compelling argument.

I would much rather a lower-salary, less-experienced CEO who actually cares about the mission enough to accept that salary, than someone who has presided over an erosion of Firefox's market share and significant layoffs, while still increasing her own salary. Clearly the system is not working by paying their CEO a market rate.

Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#888

Post by ab_testing »

I have a contrarian view that as a private company Firefox has a freedom to do whatever with the money as they see fit . Just because they are a non profit, does not mean that they need to listen to recommendations on how to best run their company. They know that they would be dead in the water if not for google’s money. So their loyalty lies in keeping google happy and their money flowing .

If I was on the board of directors of Mozilla, my main ask from the CEO would be to ensure that the money flow from google does not stop.

If that means that google decides what features make it into Firefox so be it.

Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#889

Post by Angeo34 »

wffurr wrote: post #557
gnusty_gnurc wrote: post #529

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s how you know it’s performative wokeness. There should be more uproar about an indefensible salary like that but the CEO is a woman with asymmetric hair and conformist opinions.

The rest of this thread that is not rehashing the Eich thing is exactly an uproar about an indefensible salary.

Eich is one of the worst humans in the software industry. Put aside all the social and political problems with him even technically (Brave) he values profit over human decency.
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