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Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

calpaterson.com

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Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#91

Post by raxxorrax »

ckastner wrote: post #10

The article notes the increase in pay and states > Mitchell Baker, Mozilla's top executive, was paid $2.4m in 2018 but doesn't offer any consideration or speculation as to why this is exaggerated. It's entirely possible that without that particular exec, Firefox would have been even worse off, or would have taken another direction with regards to privacy, etc. My subjective feeling is that $2.4m does indeed seem too…

CEO pay is much too high independent on the industry. It would be justified if personal responsibility was on the line, but it isn't anymore. CEOs are just employees by now.

Granted, you have to deal with pressure, but today CEO can just switch companies like underwear. They press KPI on every employee but are themselves nearly exempt from any quantifiable metric aside from turnover.

But in general CEO pay is rising with falling results and falling pay for everyone else.

Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#92

Post by pkphilip »

bmarquez wrote: post #32
ckastner wrote: post #10

The article notes the increase in pay and states > Mitchell Baker, Mozilla's top executive, was paid $2.4m in 2018 but doesn't offer any consideration or speculation as to why this is exaggerated. It's entirely possible that without that particular exec, Firefox would have been even worse off, or would have taken another direction with regards to privacy, etc. My subjective feeling is that $2.4m does indeed seem too…

The article compares it to UK based NGO's that don't pay over $1.3m USD. What about US based NGO's? I don't know where to find this data. Lastly, a FAANG may or may not pay more, but they're certainly in a much better financial position than Mozilla to pay a high salary.

Here is some data from 2019. Some of these salaries are eye watering: https://www.causeiq.com/insights/highest-paid-nonprofit-ceos...

Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#94

Post by twblalock »

Jonnax wrote: post #13

There's a quote from the CEO saying that they looked at the market and felt like they were being underpaid. And they can't reduce their salary now because it'd be unfair on their families. Firefox has a problem. It gets most of its revenue from Google. They need a different revenue stream but their ideas haven't worked. Their executives are clearly failures. But with such high pay, they're cashing out. Buying themsel…

The Mozilla execs could all make more money at FAANG companies just down the road from Mozilla HQ. If they left, it would probably be pretty hard to replace them with anyone capable of saving Firefox who would settle for less.

The same is true for most of the engineers at Mozilla. They could go to FAANGs and increase their compensation quite a bit.

So while I agree that the leadership has been bad, executive pay was not the problem. Executive decision-making was the problem. Hiring leaders who could make better decisions certainly won't be any cheaper.

Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#95

Post by drenvuk »

jameskraus wrote: post #2

Devils advocate: you have to pay a top exec more if the company looks like its main product is in decline. Plus 2.4m/year isn't crazy in the scheme of tech salaries - that exec could potentially take other roles that pay even more.

This is why I like Balmer and Tim Cook. Their fortunes are tied to the success of their companies rather than leeching off of it as it dies. I'd posit that any CEO who is not in a Ride or Die relationship with their company does not have correctly aligned incentives for their performance.

Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#96

Post by jameslk »

Jonnax wrote: post #13

There's a quote from the CEO saying that they looked at the market and felt like they were being underpaid. And they can't reduce their salary now because it'd be unfair on their families. Firefox has a problem. It gets most of its revenue from Google. They need a different revenue stream but their ideas haven't worked. Their executives are clearly failures. But with such high pay, they're cashing out. Buying themsel…

While I understand the frustration, it's unclear to me what the expected solution is for Mozilla. Pay the CEO less until the company does better? Ok but the CEO will presumably just find a higher paying job elsewhere. Then what? Find a cheaper CEO? How does that help fix the slipping market share for Firefox?

Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#97

Post by firefoxd »

The hardest thing to see here is that we don't have a solution. Firefox makes money by setting google as the default search. Google is its biggest competitor. There are no obvious other revenue stream. Also, let's not pretend chrome sucks. Chrome is on top because it is an amazing browser (and you are googling stuff anyway).

Firefox needs to change it's strategy, it needs to pull an Amazon.

Amazon is the type of business that cannot be built. It costs too much, it was not profitable, but it was a stepping stone. Amazon sold books to get people in, built AWS (a separate business) to fund the business, created a fast delivery network (also funded by AWS), and then became profitable.

Firefox needs to find it's AWS if it wants to survive.

Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#98

Post by LoSboccacc »

dvdkon wrote: post #79
jameskraus wrote: post #2

Devils advocate: you have to pay a top exec more if the company looks like its main product is in decline. Plus 2.4m/year isn't crazy in the scheme of tech salaries - that exec could potentially take other roles that pay even more.

I still don't get why companies pay ridiculous amounts of money to get execs from the outside. Every other role is (mostly) filled via promotions, why should executives be any different? Admittedly, Baker specifically got her role by being "promoted" from a Netscape lawyer and then playing a role in the creation of Mozilla, so my complaint doesn't quite apply. I'd still see letting her go and promoting someone to fil…

it depends on the company but usually the administration prefers people whose allegiance goes upward, not downward

Re: Firefox usage is down despite Mozilla's top exec pay going up

#99

Post by trabant00 »

Kicking Brendan Eich was for me the first noticeable sign of decline. Politics was just a pretext that gathered support at the time as it was very in fashion to fight for gay marriage and vilify anybody who was against it. The real reason was as usual a fight for power although the details will probably never be known outside of those involved.

Supporting such a change for unrelated political reasons was a mistake, as it always is, because you help serve the hidden interests of others. And the issue that seems important to people (gay marriage in this case) is not even affected in any way by Brendan being sidelined. But you can clearly see the effects that the new leadership - lot more interested in money, power, politics and subterfuge than tech - has had on the product.

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