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Hating on Candyland: Why most games for kids are awful

kidsdungeonadventure.com

11–20 of 63 posts

Re: Hating on Candyland: Why most games for kids are awful

#11

I've got to say, I find even Monopoly to be a terrible game. My strategy for the game can be summed up as: "buy the property if I can, otherwise pay rent if I have to". I almost never stray from that strategy, and even when I do, it's not like those exceptions make the game any more interesting.

You can have pretty interesting Monopoly games. Mine usually end up with interplayer corporations, loans for building and investing, bailouts, mergers and similar.

Re: Hating on Candyland: Why most games for kids are awful

#12

I've got to say, I find even Monopoly to be a terrible game. My strategy for the game can be summed up as: "buy the property if I can, otherwise pay rent if I have to". I almost never stray from that strategy, and even when I do, it's not like those exceptions make the game any more interesting.

To prove your point, you can buy or trade for one of each color property. Then announce "I refuse to grant any monopolies ever, it is highly unlikely this game will end in finite time" These kind of things are not possible in a modern, well-designed game.

Re: Hating on Candyland: Why most games for kids are awful

#13
post #2

The purpose of Candyland is to play a game, without playing a game. It's for toddlers to learn to take turns, to accept negative or positive outcomes without stomping off in a huff, and to play a game with a level playing field between the adults and children... and at the level we are talking about, if there is a meaningful choice at all , then the child, or perhaps rather toddler , will simply lose. It's more than…

When I have opened up this debate among friends, your counter point is the one brought up the most. I think they can learn taking turns and accepting outcomes while making decisions, even if at the start those decisions are random. Even if I concede that Candyland has a place in the progression, kids jump past it so fast I wonder if it is even worth including. Thanks for reading and responding, though.

How do you plan on addressing the problem of the result of the game being a forgone conclusion if you include meaningful choices, pretty much by definition of "meaningful"? That's the core of my point, not really the learning or discipline bits, and there's a certain mathematical inevitability about it; choices -> adults winning against young children. Or having to throw the game, and kids aren't dumb, they notice that.

Re: Hating on Candyland: Why most games for kids are awful

#14

I've got to say, I find even Monopoly to be a terrible game. My strategy for the game can be summed up as: "buy the property if I can, otherwise pay rent if I have to". I almost never stray from that strategy, and even when I do, it's not like those exceptions make the game any more interesting.

You can have pretty interesting Monopoly games. Mine usually end up with interplayer corporations, loans for building and investing, bailouts, mergers and similar.

At this point you aren't really playing Monopoly anymore. You've developed your own game using the Monopoly pieces.

Re: Hating on Candyland: Why most games for kids are awful

#15

I've got to say, I find even Monopoly to be a terrible game. My strategy for the game can be summed up as: "buy the property if I can, otherwise pay rent if I have to". I almost never stray from that strategy, and even when I do, it's not like those exceptions make the game any more interesting.

You are not playing optimally. Monopoly is far from perfect, but there is some more depth than that.

Here's two questions: - How many houses is optimal for most sets? - Would you rather have both utilities or two railroads?

Re: Hating on Candyland: Why most games for kids are awful

#16
In `A Theory of Fun`, Raph Koster writes about games being learning and teaching tools. When my brother and I would play 'soldiers' growing up, we were safely simulating, and learning from, what it would be like to be a warrior (evolutionarily, a useful identity). I always like the idea that Candyland was a game game -- it's a game to teach kids how to play games.

It's a really spectacular book; I learned a lot from it despite not being a game designer: http://www.amazon.com/Theory-Game-Design-Raph-Koster/dp/1932...

Re: Hating on Candyland: Why most games for kids are awful

#18
post #15

I've got to say, I find even Monopoly to be a terrible game. My strategy for the game can be summed up as: "buy the property if I can, otherwise pay rent if I have to". I almost never stray from that strategy, and even when I do, it's not like those exceptions make the game any more interesting.

You are not playing optimally. Monopoly is far from perfect, but there is some more depth than that. Here's two questions: - How many houses is optimal for most sets? - Would you rather have both utilities or two railroads?

That's the point though; you don't have to play optimally, doing so doesn't really make the game any more interesting.

Re: Hating on Candyland: Why most games for kids are awful

#19
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I have opened up this debate among friends, your counter point is the one brought up the most. I think they can learn taking turns and accepting outcomes while making decisions, even if at the start those decisions are random. Even if I concede that Candyland has a place in the progression, kids jump past it so fast I wonder if it is even worth including. Thanks for reading and responding, though.

How do you plan on addressing the problem of the result of the game being a forgone conclusion if you include meaningful choices, pretty much by definition of "meaningful"? That's the core of my point, not really the learning or discipline bits, and there's a certain mathematical inevitability about it; choices -> adults winning against young children. Or having to throw the game, and kids aren't dumb, they notice th…

What if the game incorporates so much randomness that the best possible decisions still only win two games of every three against the worst possible decisions?

Re: Hating on Candyland: Why most games for kids are awful

#20
post #2

The purpose of Candyland is to play a game, without playing a game. It's for toddlers to learn to take turns, to accept negative or positive outcomes without stomping off in a huff, and to play a game with a level playing field between the adults and children... and at the level we are talking about, if there is a meaningful choice at all , then the child, or perhaps rather toddler , will simply lose. It's more than…

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