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Jet Fuel Is Now So Cheap It’s Being Blended for Use by Ships

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Re: Jet Fuel Is Now So Cheap It’s Being Blended for Use by Ships

#51

Post by chinathrow »

fowl2 wrote: post #39
chinathrow wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I honestly don't understand the OZ approach as of today. We have immediate family there (sister in law) and are unable to visit. Heck we even would go to quarantine for 14 days in order to see them afterwards for a couple of weeks and/or some longer travels. The current situation where ~25'000 Australians are still unable to get back home makes no sense to me. Even leaving Australia for personal travel is not really…

They've determined that the risk of quarantine scales with the quantity of people going through it. Given the entirety of the current outbreak has been traced back to quarantine failures, this is somewhat understandable.

What current outbreak are you referring to? E.g. there is no outbreak in that sense e.g. in Western Australia (Perth).

Re: Jet Fuel Is Now So Cheap It’s Being Blended for Use by Ships

#52

Post by chinathrow »

chrisseaton wrote: post #50
chinathrow wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why should visiting after 14days of quarantine be an issue?

Is the quarantine when you get there? Doesn’t that put at risk: - everyone working at the airport and on the flight - everyone else on the flight over - people in the hospital if you get sick while quarantining And that’s even if people are obeying the quarantine. Which they often don’t. All that for a social visit? Why?

You're right about your points. Yes, there is current quarantine for arrivals in Australia when you get there. Masking removes some of that risk.

This could be solveable with a negative test and few days of quarantine pre-travel. Some countries are indeed looking at that.

> All that for a social visit? Why?

How long would you want to _not_ visit your immediate family members? What's your personal threshold?

Re: Jet Fuel Is Now So Cheap It’s Being Blended for Use by Ships

#53

Post by chrisseaton »

chinathrow wrote: post #52
chrisseaton wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the quarantine when you get there? Doesn’t that put at risk: - everyone working at the airport and on the flight - everyone else on the flight over - people in the hospital if you get sick while quarantining And that’s even if people are obeying the quarantine. Which they often don’t. All that for a social visit? Why?

You're right about your points. Yes, there is current quarantine for arrivals in Australia when you get there. Masking removes some of that risk. This could be solveable with a negative test and few days of quarantine pre-travel. Some countries are indeed looking at that. > All that for a social visit? Why? How long would you want to _not_ visit your immediate family members? What's your personal threshold?

> How long would you want to _not_ visit your immediate family members? What's your personal threshold?

People sometimes manage not seeing their actual immediate families like children and spouses for a year (for example military). It’s only been six months so far. Can people genuinely not go without seeing their siblings in-law for everyone’s sake?

Re: Jet Fuel Is Now So Cheap It’s Being Blended for Use by Ships

#54

Post by sp332 »

melling wrote: post #8
sp332 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bunker fuel is usually awful too, and this stuff has less sulfur at least.

i thought new restrictions on sulfur largely reduced emissions in shipping. https://e360.yale.edu/features/at-last-the-shipping-industry...

I hadn't realize the new restrictions were that low.

Re: Jet Fuel Is Now So Cheap It’s Being Blended for Use by Ships

#55

Post by soared »

renewiltord wrote: post #31
soared wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My favorite budget airline is doing $11 flights. I flew Denver -> SF this weekend for $33.

Which one? Is it Spirit? Those guys are a nightmare.

Frontier. Agreed, spirit isn’t even worth flying.

Re: Jet Fuel Is Now So Cheap It’s Being Blended for Use by Ships

#56

Post by fuzzfactor »

userbinator wrote: post #10
saagarjha wrote: post #2

If I'm reading the chart right, jet fuel prices are currently negative? Is this because they keep making it and have nowhere to store it? Also, > very low-sulfur fuel oil for the maritime industry I thought the maritime industry didn't care one bit about the environment and would use nasty fuel once in international waters?

I thought the maritime industry didn't care one bit about the environment and would use nasty fuel once in international waters? They don't, but if the low-sulfur fuel is cheaper, I'm sure they would use it --- that is, unless it starts causing engine problems; ULSD has lower lubricity than regular diesel: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultra-low-sulfur_diesel#Lubric...

When I certified the first bargeload of ULSD, overnight my lab went from doing LSD to Ultra-LSD.

Re: Jet Fuel Is Now So Cheap It’s Being Blended for Use by Ships

#57

Post by donavanm »

piceas wrote: post #45
donavanm wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Im in Sydney. During the peak in Q1-Q2 ~60% of infections were travelers arriving from overseas. We're currently at 3-10 infections per day, with about 50-75% of those continuing to be overseas travelers. As you noted both quarantine and testing is imperfect. I have no desire to open the doors and have a repeat of Iceland or Victoria writ large. Yes, I'm disappointed at not seeing overseas friends and family for (at…

As long as my family are able to stay healthy sure. Possibly having wait until critical illness or death before I am able to visit and help with an exemption on compassionate grounds does not reflect a healthy and functioning society in my opinion. It might be quiet though.

Im over here looking at states where I have family and your same dilemma. I suspect it's relative in these times, but Im thankful I ended up on this side of the pond.

Re: Jet Fuel Is Now So Cheap It’s Being Blended for Use by Ships

#58

Post by fuzzfactor »

dehrmann wrote: post #14
ars wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jet fuel is just kerosene. Why do you say it's hellaciously toxic? It's pretty similar to other fuels like gasoline. In rural areas you can buy kerosene at gas stations, there are no special precautions above and beyond the same ones used for gasoline for cars. Perhaps you're thinking of fuel for fighter jets? Because some of those can be incredibly toxic.

There's also Avgas. That's still leaded.

Still dyed green when leaded, blue when unleaded became available in recent decades.

Re: Jet Fuel Is Now So Cheap It’s Being Blended for Use by Ships

#59

Post by fuzzfactor »

TylerE wrote: post #15
ars wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jet fuel is just kerosene. Why do you say it's hellaciously toxic? It's pretty similar to other fuels like gasoline. In rural areas you can buy kerosene at gas stations, there are no special precautions above and beyond the same ones used for gasoline for cars. Perhaps you're thinking of fuel for fighter jets? Because some of those can be incredibly toxic.

It isn't "just kerosene". It it MOSTLY kerosene, but as usual it's the last 1% that kills you - various additives to prevent things like icing and corrosion, and benzene and various napthas.

Kerosine came first as a high-flash-point (for safety reasons) lamp fuel somewhat comparable to whale oil.

Gasoline is very volatile intentionally, but kerosine is supposed to be not-so-easy to ignite.

If you ever had to light a kerosine furnace on a cold winter day, you can drop a number of lit matches right into an ounce of it and a few will simply be extinguished before one finally catches fire.

Later, Diesel type engines could then then run on it, generally better than they could on the animal and vegetable oils which are similar enough.

Then came jet engines and industrial turbines.

Benzene and light naphthas are low-flash-point gasoline-range hydrocarbon components not found in measurable amounts in jet fuel.

However, other hydrocarbons found in jet fuel could one day be determined to be just as much of a political pollutant as Benzene.

It's possible for the same diesel-range tank to pass all modern specifications for kerosine, diesel, and jet, though rarely done.

Kerosine still has a lamp burning test, diesel has cetane requirement, turbo has various stability and trace metal specs, not shared with the other usages.

No. 1 Diesel is lighter and allows for better acceleration (but use gasoline when you really need to accelerate uphill) so it's great for Mercedes or big pickup owners, No. 2 diesel is the heavier stuff for long haul trucking MPG.

YMMV

Re: Jet Fuel Is Now So Cheap It’s Being Blended for Use by Ships

#60

Post by chinathrow »

chrisseaton wrote: post #53
chinathrow wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're right about your points. Yes, there is current quarantine for arrivals in Australia when you get there. Masking removes some of that risk. This could be solveable with a negative test and few days of quarantine pre-travel. Some countries are indeed looking at that. > All that for a social visit? Why? How long would you want to _not_ visit your immediate family members? What's your personal threshold?

> How long would you want to _not_ visit your immediate family members? What's your personal threshold? People sometimes manage not seeing their actual immediate families like children and spouses for a year (for example military). It’s only been six months so far. Can people genuinely not go without seeing their siblings in-law for everyone’s sake?

I was curious to learn another data point here, I asked you directly about your personal threshold - the reference to military is valid for nations with active long term deployments (not valid for my own comparison).
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