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I no longer build software

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Re: I no longer build software

#381

Post by DrJones1098 »

vbsteven wrote: post #98
read_if_gay_ wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Today it's just digital plumbing and dealing with all sorts of issues that are not creative. The sheer complexity is frankly absurd as well. Is this not a contradiction to you?

I feel the same way. The plumbing required has become so complex these last few years (if you use new technology). 10 years ago we uploaded the server/backend binary to a VM, installed postgres/mysql and configured nginx/haproxy as a reverse proxy/ssl termination. Now, if you want to deploy a modern SPA while using some buzzwords like k8s and devops you need: * complex frontend build process with things like webpack…

This systems you just described are virtually infinitely scalable.

Lambdas expand infinitely, k8's can easily autoscale stateless docker containers out forever.

All for starting under a 500 dollars a month?

150$ for EKS, lambdas first X million are free, and are cheap as hell from there, cloud LB is 50 bucks a month, etc.

Not to mention all the other benefits that containers provide Infrastructure as Code, no dev environment incompatibility problems, etc..

That is UNHEARD OF historically.

I think you may have some rose colored glasses or I'm just idealistic and naieve, but it's insanely exciting what's possible for a small enterprise nowdays.

The problem nowdays imo is management. The business people have taken over tech instead of tech people running things. And people without knowledge of tech, running a tech shop always makes the job suck.

Re: I no longer build software

#382

Post by dionidium »

Reminds me of jwz's line about leaving Mozilla to run a nightclub:

"But in 1999 I took my leave of that whole sick, navel-gazing mess we called the software industry. Now I'm in a more honest line of work: now I sell beer."

Re: I no longer build software

#383

Post by shadowgovt »

The running joke at my old company was "It will be done, assuming this time next quarter I haven't quit this job to assume this chaotic world of software development for the predictable life of the humble dairy farmer."

... the joke, of course, being that there's nothing predictable about being a humble dairy farmer... Cows get sick, years are better or worse, and the market is constantly fluctuating.

Re: I no longer build software

#386

Post by notacoward »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #345
matthewmacleod wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It goes without saying that your feelings are personal ones, totally valid, and nobody can really question them. I'm 20 years behind you, and I don't know what effect that will have on my views. But I don't really recognise the picture you're painting. Compared to the first steps I took as a developer about 15 years ago, almost everything about software development seems better to me. I find developing software to be…

I'm ~23 years behind GP, and I feel the same way as them already. Goes to say, this may be a matter of personality. There were few and brief moments in my career as a software developer when I was truly happy at my work. Most of those involved implementing an architecture or algorithm I figured out from scratch, or took from scientific literature - either as prototype or directly in the product. Sometimes as "hold my…

> who doesn't like their own Rube Goldberg machines?

Love that. Yes, the 1% (of which I've been a part) often get to control both the structure and rate of change for a large codebase, and in perfecting the fit to themselves they almost inevitably make the experience worse for everyone else.

Re: I no longer build software

#387

Post by hellofunk »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #50
jb1991 wrote: post #20

Amen. Modern software development is frankly kinda sucky. The old days pre-2000 were arguably a lot more enjoyable. Today it's just digital plumbing and dealing with all sorts of issues that are not creative. The sheer complexity is frankly absurd as well. I've thought about moving on from software many times, and I know many who have. Just because you can do something doesn't mean it's best way to spend your short l…

>Not to mention that sitting in front of a computer all day is not the best use of one's body. You can say that about all desk jobs(even bus drivers) since they all sit on a chair the whole day but at least in some cases we get paid better and have more free time to take care of ourselves. And unlike the bus driver, I can leave work or take a coffee/toilet break whenever I want. And labor jobs that don't require sitt…

Not all desk jobs, well certainly not all jobs where you are always sitting down, cause the same long-term strain on the eyes, however. A bus driver is at least focusing on the distance for most of the day, which is much more natural than staring at a computer monitor and its artificial light and small text for hours on end.

Re: I no longer build software

#388

Post by munchbunny »

jjice wrote: post #377
nicbou wrote: post #75

Add me to the woodworking ex-developers. I built a website that pays the bills, and now I have a lot of time on my hands. I am finishing my first piece of furniture today. It's pretty scary to work without an undo button. The physical world isn't just instructions, but movements. A little twitch can ruin a cut. A clumsy movement can dent a piece of wood you spent an hour sanding. You truly experience the meaning of "…

As a current CS student on his last year, I've heard this a lot and it's taken some time to come to terms with. I've always seen people saying they can get work down by their work, which was really scary to me at first. How could I ever become tired of the think I've loved most since I was 8? Yet, this happens to everyone, including me to a small extent during my last internship. I think everyone can grow tired of an…

The problem with programming for a job is that you don't get to do it on your own terms. If you really focus on it and have a bit of luck, you can align your job with the stuff you wanted to do anyway, but even then every 40 hours is probably 30 hours of not particularly interesting work and 10 hours of the stuff you loved when you first fell in love with programming.

Re: I no longer build software

#389

Post by [deleted] »

jlangenauer wrote: post #278
matthewmacleod wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It goes without saying that your feelings are personal ones, totally valid, and nobody can really question them. I'm 20 years behind you, and I don't know what effect that will have on my views. But I don't really recognise the picture you're painting. Compared to the first steps I took as a developer about 15 years ago, almost everything about software development seems better to me. I find developing software to be…

I think you are right to say that the methods are vastly improved, but the ends to which those methods are applied have become ever more uninteresting (for a lot of people), and often morally suspect. We have built exquisite tools, but we use them to extract profit, to manipulate behaviour and often for no discernable purpose at all. Programming has become joyless. There are ever-shrinking spaces where a developer ge…

[deleted]

Re: I no longer build software

#390

Post by Chris2048 »

qw wrote: post #315
Chris2048 wrote: post #149

The question is, why is it all so BS. I think the answer is, whenever you get to any kind of scale, you leave the logical world of engineering discipline, and enter the corporate world of product infighting. Who hasn't tried a small, personal project just as a clean walled-garden-of-the-mind to relax in, free from the reality of real software. I think every SWEs dream is that all software will be just as clean. But C…

I think one of the problems is that a lot of the management methods are built for the lowest common denominator. Juniors and mediocre developers who "need" direction and strict structure. Micro management is easier than creating a culture where developers are empowered to make independent decisions, based on shared goals and understanding. At some point talented developers grow out of that role and start looking for…

But I see the same everywhere at many levels. There seems to be some effort to "commoditise" development. Nice idea, but only really the committed expertise and resources of Microsoft or equivalent could achieve this - all other attempt devolve to some form of micromanagement.
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