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We need physical audio kill switches

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Re: We need physical audio kill switches

#191

Post by closeparen »

mindslight wrote: post #165
onion-soup wrote: post #11

Nothing will ever come close to convenience of analogue volume knobs. They give both immediate action and infinite granular control. Same goes for kitchen stoves. All the modern touch controls with step-based control is the absolute nightmare in terms of UI.

The biggest problem with "modern" digital controls, the lag, is completely avoidable. One can easily design a system using a microcontroller that responds within 10ms, which gives the appearance of being instantaneous. It's all just shoddy software engineering using bloated frameworks and poor languages, and consumers that don't know any better. Somehow we've had this problem going on a decade, and nobody has seen fi…

What languages and frameworks are people using in consumer electronics?

Re: We need physical audio kill switches

#192

Post by whywhywhywhy »

>I hit the mute button on my MacBook Pro Touchbar, and it took a solid two seconds for it to register. My ears were ringing throughout the whole call. This is unacceptable.

The USB-C era MacBook Pros had some serious degradation in the audio department. The previous much loved generation, you plug headphones in the audio system switches to them so fast it's perceivable as instant, the USB-C era there is at best a 0.5 delay and at worst a 2 second delay.

During this delay anything you change volume wise will actually apply to the previous setting not the new setting, so the usual scenario where you're in the office you have the speakers on mute, plug in headphones then you don't hear anything because of the delay so you hit volume up will actually set your speakers off mute. Later on you unplug your headphones and your laptops speakers are then blaring out whatever you were playing instead of remaining on mute.

This situation would never happen in the pre-USB-C MBP because the headphone switch was instant, it felt like a hardwired connection. Like a lot of things on the USB-C MacBooks interactions like sound and power feel more like interfacing with a what people may call a "device" rather than a computer, there are tangible layers that have to handshake between your real world action and the hardware catching up sometimes seconds later.

(This is all the non-touchbar model, so it's not just that)

Re: We need physical audio kill switches

#193

Post by avip »

wvenable wrote: post #92
brandon272 wrote: post #29

I let my spouse, who likes the novelty of a touchscreen, talk me into a Whirlpool oven a couple years ago that is controlled by touchscreen. I had no idea it was possible to hate an oven so much. The only saving grace is that the stovetop elements are still controlled by knobs.

My work coffee maker has a touch screen and the interface is so laggy it's insane. The manufacturer controls every aspect of the hardware and software so it makes no sense -- either make the hardware more powerful or make the software simpler!

I can reproducibly deadlock my workplace coffee machine.

You press the coffee type and immediately hit the "clean" button. Then the machine is dead with no recourse other than unplug. Try that trick on a Makineta.

Re: We need physical audio kill switches

#194

Post by closeparen »

JD557 wrote: post #162
mrkwse wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

macOS disables the audio control of HDMI outputs because that is what the HDMI specification expects/defines. If you think of all the devices that output via HDMI, Windows PCs are the outlier (afaik, not sure how Linux handles it) in allowing separate volume controls beyond those on the output device. Satellite set top boxes, media streaming devices (e.g. Apple TV - I realise NVidia Shield and some Chromecast apps do…

>Set top boxes Maybe that's a regional thing, but I think that all set top boxes (and DTV decoders) that I used had it's own remote with adjustable volume.

My Fire TV and my old cable box remotes both had volume controls on them, but they were programmed to emit IR signals directly to the TV.

Re: We need physical audio kill switches

#195

Post by vehementi »

romwell wrote: post #174
vidanay wrote: post #4

I have accomplished this by using an external audio mixer at my desk. I have physical volume controls for three PC's, two ham radios, and a police scanner. Then there is a master volume control for everything mixed.

Same here. One advantage of a home studio setup is many, many sweet knobs. The musicians have figured it long ago that physical controls and no latency is a must. $50 mixer solves many problems.

If I could power on my computer with a giant roller coaster pull lever I would

Re: We need physical audio kill switches

#196

Post by kempbellt »

moe wrote: post #185
MereInterest wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And even if there is a physical switch, it is not clear what that switch is doing. My bluetooth headset has a hardware on/off switch. However, when the switch is turned off, it plays a sound to say the words "power off". If it were a physical switch across the battery, then I would expect the power to be immediately cut, and it shouldn't have the power to say that the power has been cut.

But then how would you know it's really off!

I sense sarcasm, but I'll answer anyway.

A power indicator light would do the trick...

But in all seriousness, your bluetooth headphones should have a sim card built in and be an IoT slave to the cloud. So that when you turn them off, they send a message to Alexa, Google, and Siri, so that all of your devices can tell you "YOUR HEADPHONES ARE NOW OFF" at the same time. Like a tiny choir of angels informing you of the new state of your device.

But of course, there will be one slow/older device that lags 0.3 seconds behind and says "HEADPHONES...OFF", completely out of sync with the rest, like a rebel.

Damnit, toilet! Get with the times...

Re: We need physical audio kill switches

#197

Post by echoteecat »

ericlewis wrote: post #152
wvenable wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My work coffee maker has a touch screen and the interface is so laggy it's insane. The manufacturer controls every aspect of the hardware and software so it makes no sense -- either make the hardware more powerful or make the software simpler!

This is where NLP would excel or even some nice regex. It doesn’t have to be this hard.

"Computer, Coffee. Black."

Re: We need physical audio kill switches

#198

Post by closeparen »

MereInterest wrote: post #177
mrkwse wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

macOS disables the audio control of HDMI outputs because that is what the HDMI specification expects/defines. If you think of all the devices that output via HDMI, Windows PCs are the outlier (afaik, not sure how Linux handles it) in allowing separate volume controls beyond those on the output device. Satellite set top boxes, media streaming devices (e.g. Apple TV - I realise NVidia Shield and some Chromecast apps do…

It's still a really poor decision, because it doesn't extend well to having multiple sources. For example, my tv is connected both to my media computer, and to a Nintendo Switch. If the computer is active, then the volume should be around 50 on a 0-100 scale. If the Switch is active, then the volume should be around 10 to get the same level of output. I would love to have a way to tell the Switch that it should adjus…

The average TV owner doesn’t know the phrase “gain structure” - they are going to set the cable box at 5 and the TV at 100, and then call customer service for the TV because it sounds terrible and won’t get loud enough.

Re: We need physical audio kill switches

#199

Post by yitchelle »

onion-soup wrote: post #11

Nothing will ever come close to convenience of analogue volume knobs. They give both immediate action and infinite granular control. Same goes for kitchen stoves. All the modern touch controls with step-based control is the absolute nightmare in terms of UI.

Touch screens in cars are really a bad move. Having to navigate it while driving down the freeway, or even your suburban streets is unbelievable risky. Knobs and push buttons with tactile feedback are still the best options.

Re: We need physical audio kill switches

#200

Post by m463 »

skohan wrote: post #126

I've been thinking the same about power switches lately. If I turn a flashlight, or an old radio on or off, I flip a switch and get the result I want. With my 65 EUR gamepad, or 300 EUR headphones, I hold a button and wait several seconds for the result. Why has UX regressed so much in these areas?

I have always wanted a flashlight with a brightness knob, that clicks to off.

It is incredibly hard to find this. I have one somewhere, but the knob was a little silly:

https://amzn.com/B07BDQS3XX

I think a better design would be a ring around the circumference that you twist.

But I agree - when it came to putting a good stereo in my car (when you used to be able to do such a thing) I always kept looking until I found one with an actual volume knob. In a moving car - grabbing a knob and finding the right volume level is immediate and doable.

By the way, schiit hel: https://www.schiit.com/products/hel

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