The Presence of One’s Own Smartphone Reduces Available Cognitive Capacity (2017) • Hacker News Board

Re: The Presence of One’s Own Smartphone Reduces Available Cognitive Capacity (2017)

#331

Post by johnchristopher » Sat, Sep 19, 2020, 1:51 PM UTC

perlgod wrote: post #37

stevensawtelle wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you talk more to the practicalities of getting rid of a smartphone? Have you seriously found that the loss of the conveniences they bring haven't been that burdensome? I am really intrigued by the idea but find it almost inconceivable to work for me (which might speak to an addiction, so I feel compelled to understand this further)

I have not found it to be overly burdensome. I have an indestructible kyocera flip phone, so I'm able to call people (and SMS in a pinch). I have an LTE-enabled tablet, so if I'm going somewhere totally unfamiliar, I'll throw it in my bag just in case I need to look up some information. Otherwise you just have to plan your outings in advance - like we always did prior to 2008 or so. I have a Garmin GPS mounted in car…

So, basically, you replaced a multipurpose device for specific devices you take with you if needed. Not really pre 2008 tech.

Re: The Presence of One’s Own Smartphone Reduces Available Cognitive Capacity (2017)

#332

Post by tboyd47 » Sat, Sep 19, 2020, 2:00 PM UTC

stevensawtelle wrote: post #15

perlgod wrote: post #10

Getting rid of my smartphone was without a doubt the most positive thing I ever did for myself. I'm sure some people have the self-control to use it sparingly. But for me, not having to constantly fight the urge to check my always-connected magic pocket internet portal has freed up a huge amount of my mental willpower, which I can now redirect to other more important things. Now that everything is closed, I don't eve…

Can you talk more to the practicalities of getting rid of a smartphone? Have you seriously found that the loss of the conveniences they bring haven't been that burdensome? I am really intrigued by the idea but find it almost inconceivable to work for me (which might speak to an addiction, so I feel compelled to understand this further)

There are different levels of “getting rid of.”

I have several smartphones but don’t use them as phones, and don’t carry them on my person. For cell service I have a dumb phone (Alcatel MyFlip) I keep on me.

I’ve operated like this for years and find no loss of convenience at all. Whatever I need a smartphone for (2FA codes, podcasts, Discord, etc.) I can do at home with Wi-Fi. Everything else I can do on a computer. The only thing mildly inconvenient is having to ask people for directions sometimes (which is really only inconvenient for them, because of their embarrassment at not being able to explain how to get to their own house).

Overall, it definitely helps with social etiquette and living in the moment. It makes you more in tune with other people.

Having to keep a smartphone on you at all times to function is a burden, instead of the other way around. It’s a burden placed on you by corporations and governments.

Re: The Presence of One’s Own Smartphone Reduces Available Cognitive Capacity (2017)

#333

Post by slothtrop » Sat, Sep 19, 2020, 2:32 PM UTC

VoodooJuJu wrote: post #324

slothtrop wrote: post #146

New hot take: I'm addicted to my laptop. The phone barely registers in terms of interest because I work on my laptop anyway, which is less cumbersome to navigate. Notwithstanding the need to separate work from leisure life, much of leisure is just attached to this device. Even the less consumptive activities, like writing or playing music, benefit from it. And anything to do with innovation or research is absolutely…

>What I'd like to see in the future is AR tech that rewards mobility and in-person interaction I think everything you said was great up until here. Technology is part of the problem, so instead of just patching the symptom with even more technology, let's remove the cause: stop consuming, or rather, stop being consumed by, technology. You want to get away from the screen? Then get away. You want to go socialize with…

> Technology is part of the problem

I was more explicit: screens time is the problem. We interface with all manner of technology in our daily lives that I don't find myself attached to, including electronics. Everything we use, all our tools, is technology. Colloquially we use the term to refer to computers.

I can reframe the problem in other ways, e.g. what would allow me to achieve certain things without screens?

> You want to get away from the screen? Then get away. You want to go socialize with people in-person? Then just do it.

I already do this, as described. I spend more time on screens because more of what I actually want to do requires it.

There are types of interactions besides socializing for its own sake. Technology already bridges gaps with the likes of meetup websites. I think something conducive to collaborating on projects in person would be welcome.

> It doesn't have to deepen.

Well Luddites are not suddenly going to gain traction.

> Nor can it deepen, because the resource requirements for producing and powering higher technology come at an ever-increasing cost, subsidized by the environment and future generations.

Innovation by nature will ultimately reduce costs, though an increasing rate of adoption by the population could outpace it.

Every person has an environmental footprint, and it's greater in the West. Between transportation both public and private, a residence, food, gadgets, etc it adds up and were this something to be curbed, taking devices away would be woefully insufficient at making the difference. The population rate just needs to drop, which can be alleviated by eliminating global poverty. The popularized push for minimalism while watching the population explode is a race to the bottom.

Re: The Presence of One’s Own Smartphone Reduces Available Cognitive Capacity (2017)

#334

Post by chestervonwinch » Sat, Sep 19, 2020, 2:46 PM UTC

MiroF wrote: post #182

slothtrop wrote: post #146

New hot take: I'm addicted to my laptop. The phone barely registers in terms of interest because I work on my laptop anyway, which is less cumbersome to navigate. Notwithstanding the need to separate work from leisure life, much of leisure is just attached to this device. Even the less consumptive activities, like writing or playing music, benefit from it. And anything to do with innovation or research is absolutely…

Buy books and print research papers? Personally, I don't view a black/white Kindle as the same as other screens, so a bike ride to a park where I might read a research paper or book I've put on my Kindle.

> print research papers?

I took this approach when I was in grad school because I find it much more enjoyable to read and take notes directly on a physical copy.

The problem with this is that you end up with giant stacks of papers that take up a good amount of physical space. Every physical copy becomes a subsequent judgement of whether you need to keep it or recycle it. It's easy to accumulate a large stack of papers: (1) that you _intend_ to read, or (2) mediocre papers that create a sunk cost situation because you've invested time in printing out and taking notes on it.

On the face of it, a tablet reader seems like it would solve this problem, but I've never had the desire to invest $300-500 in one.

Re: The Presence of One’s Own Smartphone Reduces Available Cognitive Capacity (2017)

#335

Post by MiroF » Sat, Sep 19, 2020, 3:17 PM UTC

chestervonwinch wrote: post #334

MiroF wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Buy books and print research papers? Personally, I don't view a black/white Kindle as the same as other screens, so a bike ride to a park where I might read a research paper or book I've put on my Kindle.

> print research papers? I took this approach when I was in grad school because I find it much more enjoyable to read and take notes directly on a physical copy. The problem with this is that you end up with giant stacks of papers that take up a good amount of physical space. Every physical copy becomes a subsequent judgement of whether you need to keep it or recycle it. It's easy to accumulate a large stack of paper…

> a tablet reader

A black/white mobi tablet reader is closer to $100 than $300-$500, just in case you ever decide to change your mind.

Re: The Presence of One’s Own Smartphone Reduces Available Cognitive Capacity (2017)

#336

Post by L_226 » Sat, Sep 19, 2020, 3:43 PM UTC

slothtrop wrote: post #146

New hot take: I'm addicted to my laptop. The phone barely registers in terms of interest because I work on my laptop anyway, which is less cumbersome to navigate. Notwithstanding the need to separate work from leisure life, much of leisure is just attached to this device. Even the less consumptive activities, like writing or playing music, benefit from it. And anything to do with innovation or research is absolutely…

> What I'd like to see in the future is AR tech that rewards mobility and in-person interaction, creating collaborative spaces anywhere.

heya, I am working on exactly this with https://app.mirrorspace.net (alpha)

Re: The Presence of One’s Own Smartphone Reduces Available Cognitive Capacity (2017)

#337

Post by swiley » Sat, Sep 19, 2020, 3:54 PM UTC

slothtrop wrote: post #146

New hot take: I'm addicted to my laptop. The phone barely registers in terms of interest because I work on my laptop anyway, which is less cumbersome to navigate. Notwithstanding the need to separate work from leisure life, much of leisure is just attached to this device. Even the less consumptive activities, like writing or playing music, benefit from it. And anything to do with innovation or research is absolutely…

The problem with the smartphone is that the UX is designed in such a way that helpful rituals are hard to develop. If you want access to something at all it has to be right in your face.

Re: The Presence of One’s Own Smartphone Reduces Available Cognitive Capacity (2017)

#338

Post by idiocrat » Sat, Sep 19, 2020, 3:58 PM UTC

One possible factor could be that if those researchers are taking away the source of my happiness hormones (the sweet cloud of mindless meme browsing) that then my brain goes in overdrive and releases fighter hormones, so I can quickly finish with that stupid experiment and that I get my toy back quickly.

I think they are measuring the wrong thing.

A junkie can get very creative and intelligent just to get his/her next shot.

Re: The Presence of One’s Own Smartphone Reduces Available Cognitive Capacity (2017)

#339

Post by efreak » Sat, Sep 19, 2020, 4:29 PM UTC

foxdev wrote: post #214

ckosidows wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've started leaving my phone out of my gym time as well. It feels like the right thing to do, but it definitely feels odd or like I'm different somehow. At the gym I go to everyone listens to music while lifting and it's almost surreal to look around while resting between sets to see everyone is dialed into their own little world. I wonder what gyms looked like in earlier generations (I'm only 27). Did people talk m…

Latter seasons of Highlander tell me they were mostly for people to test their rivals out before a final confrontation in another part of the city in the final act.

According to pokemon, gyms exist only as a place for making your pet fight someone else's pet

Re: The Presence of One’s Own Smartphone Reduces Available Cognitive Capacity (2017)

#340

Post by gus_massa » Sat, Sep 19, 2020, 4:30 PM UTC

gentleman11 wrote: post #292

socalnate1 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find this response overly dismissive. Did you read the paper or just the abstract? Dismissing the work of marketing professors out of hand isn't the right approach. What if this is one of the half of psychology papers that do replicate?

I read part of the paper. Note the graphs where the y axis is as short as possible to make the effect size look larger. The title is explicitly non-serious. They also represent that they can measure cognitive capacity and fluid intelligence reliably and meaningfully, instead of presenting the data more clearly in the form of... data, eg, raw text scores. It also lacks the sort of control group that has a non-smartpho…

In the physics lab the T.A. will yell at you if choose a scale that starts at zero instead of a scale that shows only the relevant section. When the T.A. is tired, he/she will ask another T.A. to continue the yelling. (Or sometimes just make you redo the report until you choose the correct scale.)

The research journal have a similar policy.

For some reason people in the Internet don't like it, so a solution for a blog post is to show both graphs. One that starts at zero and other with the relevant section.